Building Reserve and Using KWH

[DanS26]

I use a set of the older DROK models to monitor split phases from my pad mounted generator. I think its important to balance the loads on my 10kW generator.

Monitoring.JPG

[bcroe]

240VAC stuff is outside the capabilities of my KILL-A-WATT. Based on the recommendation by DanS26
I decide to try that DROK 6-IN-1 MULTIMETER --- voltage, current, power, power factor, frequency and
KWH. The 240VAC heat pump clothes dryer has different loading on the 2 halves of 240VAC, so I set up
a pair which monitor each. For 2 wire 240VAC loads there is a switch, to allow one meter to monitor all
with the other meter off.


DualPwrM3.JPG


DualPwrM4.JPG


Measurements. The dual meter pair consumed 1.7W itself, the dryer 0.9W vampire load. When started
up the dryer used about 1500W on one side, half that on the other, power factor near 1. After a few
minutes running it dropped down to a pretty steady 800W and 400W, power factor more like 0.8. The
run was for about 1.6 hr, with moisture sensing, using close to 1.9 KWH total. I am informed overall it
was a great light show. But the (reversible) door hinges are on the wrong side.

Meanwhile am getting much more sun than predicted this month, with warmer temps am still building a
bit more KWH reserve. Usually the slide down starts about 1 Nov. Across the river are some power
outages from the overnight storm, but here the array is cranking out 15KW. Bruce Roe

[Mike90250]

I just found out, hardware store grade propane for my plumbing, looses its gas pressure when out in my
shed near freezing. Had to leave it in a heated building for a while to proceed. Must be different than
what is in the 500 gal tank outside.

Same grade, but it's the surface area of the puddle of propane in the tank, the little one only has a small amount of area to boil off vapor, the big tank has lots lots of surface area to get vapor from, and when it's cold enough, it won't be able to keep up either
https://propane.com/safety/safety-ar...-vapor-demand/

PropaneVaporPressure temp.jpg

[bcroe]

The Oct PoCo net metering bill arrived, showed the KWH reserve starting toward winter near 14,000
KWH, about right. One more week of mostly warm and sun to build on that, before serious cold.

The use of Energy Star appliances has contributed a lot to reducing energy consumption here. Those
are all electrically powered, the universal energy management technology, and the one my solar net
metering system embraces. Most of the electric appliances have been up graded to Energy Star units.
The apparently 4 decade old electric stove remains, and the ancient microwave has been modified to
draw ZERO vampire energy until the door is opened.

I have been watching for high efficiency electric replacements for the 2 remaining propane appliances
here, water heater and clothes dryer. Much rather do those functions using my available, surplus KWH,
than buy more propane.

I did not like seeing the propane flame exhaust heat blowing outside in the winter. So an unvented
clothes dryer with over 7 cu ft capacity was needed. The PoCo has been trying to steer me into high
priced suppliers, and finally they showed a model meeting my needs, the full size instead of so many
4 cu ft unvented. It is a Whirlpool-WHD560CHW, another electronic marvel. It was far from the top
of the PoCo recommendations, and I found a much better price for it (including delivery) locally.



Whirlpool.JPG


I hooked up this UNVENTED heat pump hybrid electric dryer and did a load. Very easy to connect, just a
30A line and a drain hose. Apparently its heat pump takes heat from the surrounding air, to dry clothes.
That heat energy is recirculated instead of constantly blowing out of the house. Finally, whatever energy
was used remains to heat the house in winter, the clothes line is still functional when the weather suits in
summer. It takes perhaps 50% to 100% longer to finish than the propane unit, I can wait. No more cold
air coming in from the outdoor vent all the rest of the time.

It dumps condensate down the drain. My clamp on ammeter shows unbalanced 240VAC drain, significant
current running down the neutral wire. Am guessing it uses a 120VAC motor, but a 240VAC heat pump.
Not ideal, but it works, wants a 4 wire cord, 30A breaker. It will be a bit more complex to measure the
KWH used per load, and I would like to see the variations on each line as it progresses.

Now the only propane device being used (propane furnace is only a standby backup) is the water heater.
I would like to attach a Nyle Water Heating - Geyser heat pump model, but a revised model will not be
available till 2021. It can be moved from one heater (gas or electric) to the next if (WHEN) a tank fails.

I just found out, hardware store grade propane for my plumbing, looses its gas pressure when out in my
shed near freezing. Had to leave it in a heated building for a while to proceed. Must be different than
what is in the 500 gal tank outside. Bruce Roe

[DanS26]

Pretty cool, and cheap. A number of such meters have been worked into equipment
here. Whenever I get an AC watt meter, I connect a big cap to draw current with a
zero power factor. A good meter reads zero, just multiplying the A and V will be wrong.
Bruce Roe

Their 6 in 1 meter indicates the PF......for $21 its a good deal........

https://www.amazon.com/DROK-Frequenc...ef_=ast_sto_dp

[bcroe]

I use these little meters all over the place, they are accurate and inexpensive..........

Pretty cool, and cheap. A number of such meters have been worked into equipment
here. Whenever I get an AC watt meter, I connect a big cap to draw current with a
zero power factor. A good meter reads zero, just multiplying the A and V will be wrong.
Bruce Roe

[J.P.M.]

I use these little meters all over the place, they are accurate and inexpensive..........

https://www.amazon.com/drok

Price looks right. How did you verify their accuracy ? Any accuracy number estimates ?

Thanks in advance.

J.P.M.

[DanS26]

I use these little meters all over the place, they are accurate and inexpensive..........

https://www.amazon.com/drok

[J.P.M.]

That is what I needed, thanks. I see my Sangamo meter (originally used on this 70s house)
has a 7.2 at 4 o'clock position, which would equal 138.88.. revolutions per KWH. My best
estimate had been 144, but not done with great precision. 138.88 would correspond to 35 rpm
(really honking!) when the array peaks and nothing else runs, just about what was observed.

I have also done the stop watch thing, but also used the Kill-A-Watt meter for totals on cycling
stuff (fridge). Have also wired a disc meter in series with a double breaker output for 240VAC
stuff. With several disc meters here from varied sources, guess I now have the means to check
them out. Bruce Roe
ENEmeter.png

You're at least most welcome.

Unless you advise you need more info, I'll cancel my walk down memory lane with my notes.

Respectfully,

[bcroe]

. As I seem to recall, my old rotary meter constant was 7.2 which meant that 7.2 Watt-hours of energy have been expended for each complete dial revolution - at least when it got manufactured. Your meter may have a similar constant. I believe the meter constants are often printed in the lower left (~ 4 o'clock) position of most of the old rotary meters. 7.2 is a common one for old G./E. meters but they vary a lot.

For my steady state energy appliance use estimation, I checked the difference in dial rotation speeds/times with most everything in the house off at the circuit breakers, particularly cyclic appliances like fridges and measured the difference in rotation times 100 disk revs with a stopwatch when various "semi" known things got turned on like a 100 W incandescent bulb, a spot heater w/ 3 range settings, etc. and got numbers that seemed to make sense.

That is what I needed, thanks. I see my Sangamo meter (originally used on this 70s house)
has a 7.2 at 4 o'clock position, which would equal 138.88.. revolutions per KWH. My best
estimate had been 144, but not done with great precision. 138.88 would correspond to 35 rpm
(really honking!) when the array peaks and nothing else runs, just about what was observed.

I have also done the stop watch thing, but also used the Kill-A-Watt meter for totals on cycling
stuff (fridge). Have also wired a disc meter in series with a double breaker output for 240VAC
stuff. With several disc meters here from varied sources, guess I now have the means to check
them out. Bruce Roe
ENEmeter.png

[J.P.M.]

I was wondering if anyone knew, how many revolutions of a spinning disc meter, equal one KWH?
My estimate is somewhere around 150 revolutions. I see a lot of calibration marks on the disc,
wonder if they serve for factory calibration? Bruce Roe

You're going to make me dig into my archives/notes. As I recall, there was a meter constant in the lower right side of the old dial meters that was used to find what you're looking for. Using that and a stop watch was a good way for me to get definitional info on steady state draw for appliances/HVAC equipment and even kill-a-watt meter comparisons. The numbers seemed to work out and make sense.
I'll root around and see what I can find. Give me a day or so.

As I seem to recall, my old rotary meter constant was 7.2 which meant that 7.2 Watt-hours of energy have been expended for each complete dial revolution - at least when it got manufactured. Your meter may have a similar constant. I believe the meter constants are often printed in the lower left (~ 4 o'clock) position of most of the old rotary meters. 7.2 is a common one for old G./E. meters but they vary a lot. I usually used 100 revs to measure appliance usage and did the measurement several times. The method seems good for steady state operation but is mostly useless for guessing at startup transients or power factor penalties.

For my steady state energy appliance use estimation, I checked the difference in dial rotation speeds/times with most everything in the house off at the circuit breakers, particularly cyclic appliances like fridges and measured the difference in rotation times 100 disk revs with a stopwatch when various "semi" known things got turned on like a 100 W incandescent bulb, a spot heater w/ 3 range settings, etc. and got numbers that seemed to make sense.

For things like the A/C w/ 2 electricity draws, I figured out the compressor and air handler drew a total of something like ~ 6,000 W at steady state conditions but, as I implied above, I don't have my notes handy. Anyway, I checked the air handler w/a kill-a-watt meter at 842 running watts. I have that because I had to replace the air handler motor a couple of years ago and I have a dedicated kill-a-watt meter on the blower it to record approx. A/C system run time.

[bcroe]

I was wondering if anyone knew, how many revolutions of a spinning disc meter, equal one KWH?
My estimate is somewhere around 150 revolutions. I see a lot of calibration marks on the disc,
wonder if they serve for factory calibration? Bruce Roe

[bcroe]

. A non vented electric clothes drier would be the
other item, except they are pretty small. Bruce Roe

Today I see a 7.4 cu ft heat pump hybrid unvented electric clothes dryer, seriously considering
getting one. There have been small unvented ones, but this one is full sized. I always hated
blowing all that heat outside, and the vent leaks plenty of air the rest of the time. Whirlpool.
Bruce Roe

[bcroe]

. Here's a peek inside......dual MPPT.....hinge on side.

That looks great, I went and opened the cover of my unpowered standby Fronius for the
first time, and it looks just like that. Apparently 2 inverters the same size, I knew they
shut one down to increase efficiency for light loading. The whole thing made possible by
the development of the microprocessor (control) and power MOSFET transistors (muscle),
not to mention economical solar panels. I had used them and IGFETs, but now I guess
silicon carbide transistors or the like have taken over.

Just amazing how something that light and cool running can handle that much power.

I looked at the bottom section, looks like the fuses are connected to the plus red leads, so
I guess that means it is set for negative ground. I think this one came with fuses, my
originals had shorting slugs. Bruce Roe

[DanS26]

So, show us the pictures. Does it hinge open just like the bottom section? Bruce Roe

Here's a peek inside......dual MPPT.....hinge on side.


IMG_0684.JPG