My New Favorite Battery.

[russ]

Just that car thing. But Musk does waste time with that space flight thing. It's not like his companies have real engineers, right? It's all obviously all show.

donald - Right - his space thing is going real well isn't it! He needs some good news from somewhere.

It takes more than engineers.

[donald]

Tesla has ZERO experience

Just that car thing. But Musk does waste time with that space flight thing. It's not like his companies have real engineers, right? It's all obviously all show.

[Sunking]

Not so fast.

http://www.teslamotors.com/powerwall

$350/kWh for Lithium based battery system (entire system, not just cell costs).
Temperature controlled.
10 year warranty.
Designed for daily cycling.

Looks like there is now a #1 contender.

Not even close to being equal. Tesla has ZERO experience and no testing done with solar. You cannot even buy the Tesla battery.

The Trojan in independent testing labs has been under testing for 5 years now exceeding over 2500 cycle to 80% DOD. Based on preliminary testing is indicating it is a 10 to 15 year battery. Tesla does not have anything, just an add.

[SunEagle]

Not so fast.

http://www.teslamotors.com/powerwall

$350/kWh for Lithium based battery system (entire system, not just cell costs).
Temperature controlled.
10 year warranty.
Designed for daily cycling.

Looks like there is now a #1 contender.

How is a $350/kWh (10kWh battery) or $428/kWh (7kWh battery) being better then the $330/kWh that Trojan is promoting?

Until Tesla provides more info than "daily cycling" and 10 year warranty you are really guessing at it's abilities.

[russ]

Actually they say 7 kW for 3,000$ - The weekly thingy seems not useful

If this were real the utilities would be all over it - to them it is big money. Wait and see!

[SmartElectric]

For this type of quality you are going to pay a premium of about $330 per Kwh. If you calculate 8 year service using 5 day autonomy you are looking a paying 56-cents per Kwh in battery cost. Not bad considering the #2 contender is 65-cents per Kwh. .... Pretty much puts the Lithium batteries out of business in the RE market. Trojan Industrial line last longer than any lithium and half the initial price.

Not so fast.

http://www.teslamotors.com/powerwall

$350/kWh for Lithium based battery system (entire system, not just cell costs).
Temperature controlled.
10 year warranty.
Designed for daily cycling.

Looks like there is now a #1 contender.

[Sunking]

I have been watching a particular battery that has been undergoing IEC 61427 since 2010 and as of today has just over 2500 cycles which is almost unheard of. IEC 61427 is a grueling test protocol for testing RE batteries using real life operating procedures. For one to give you an idea is the batteries are submerged into a 40 degree Celsius water bath to control temperature which is hot. The test is done in the PSOS range of 20 to 80% DOD which is realistically where solar and wind systems operate.

Anyway this battery product line looks to be a solid 8 to 10 year battery from a battery manufacture that has been in business since 1925 and will be around for a long time. They are most notable known for Golf Cart and Floor Machine batteries. Yep Trojan.

The product line is Trojans Industrial Line with Smart Carbon Technology. Like any new release in batteries, I am always skeptical, but the IEC 61427 testing program is not only being done by Trojan, but also Sandia National Labs and both are showing similar results. Trojan released the Smart Carbon Technology in their RE and Industrial lines about a year ago. The Industrial line has a 8 year warranty and made to operate in PSOC range. Trojans Industrial line was originally developed for the fork lift market, but now being marketed to the RE market.

Before anyone rushes out to buy a set take notice these are serious batteries, no such thing as a small capacity in this line up. The smallest is a 6 volt @ 465 AH battery and the largest is 2 volts @ 1850 AH. So these batteries are made for serious off-grid users of 24 to 60 volt systems and up.

For this type of quality you are going to pay a premium of about $330 per Kwh. If you calculate 8 year service using 5 day autonomy you are looking a paying 56-cents per Kwh in battery cost. Not bad considering the #2 contender is 65-cents per Kwh. With the PSOC capabilities of the battery you can realistically lower Autonomy to 4 days giving you a real 3 day reserve and that drop cost to 46-cents per Kwh battery cost. Sounds expensive and it is, but we are talking off-grid solar and these batteries are the least expensive on the market, and fortunately the best on the market in FLA batteries. Pretty much puts the Lithium batteries out of business in the RE market. Trojan Industrial line last longer than any lithium and half the initial price.