Price paid per watt

[araghava]

I would also disagree with some of what sms says. I paid 3$/W in San Francisco. I did so by avoiding the Solar companies and going with a General Contractor. I bought large panels because they are cheaper than the more efficient smaller ones. This was not a problem for me because i have a large flat roof. My post tax cost is 2.1 $/W. There are certainly cons with my approach. I don't have a warranty but am willing to live without one.

[sensij]

These do look like lessons straight out of a solar salesman's book.

#4 is problematic, since paying more up front for higher wattage panels is definitely *not* a sure thing, and depends heavily on the price paid vs the how long the system is expected to be owned. Because the "payback" period (however you choose to define it) is usually longer for higher $ / W system, people who may not expect to live in their homes forever may be better off with the lower wattage system. Although a larger system may generate the most financial benefit over, say, 20 years, over 10 years that some use for their projections it is much less obvious.

#2 and 3 are offered without explanation. I think you'll find reasonable disagreement on the relative value of polycrystalline vs monocrystalline panels, and also the perceived value of SolarEdge even in non-shaded installations.

#11 Requires more research into the rate projections. You might not realize it, but even your $0.33 / kWh is likely to be decreasing over the next few years.

#9 is a mix of misinformation and complete speculation. The tax credit is in place through 2016. After 2016, no one knows what will happen.

#5 is kind of silly too. Installers with diverse revenue streams are more likely to be in business as market cycles for the different services they offer rise and fall.

#8 is false logic. Whether the service panel upgrade is bundled with the install or done by a pure electrician, the tax reporting is not affected either way. If it is part of the solar electric property, it doesn't matter whether the costs are on just one or the sum of many separate invoices.

[sms]

$4.70/watt before tax incentives. $3.09/watt after rebates and tax incentives. Silicon Valley, CA. PG&E. Paying 33¢/KWH in third and fourth tiers.

Sixteen 345 watt Sunpower panels (5520 watts)
No optimizers.
Sunnyboy Inverter.
Concrete Tile Roof.

This includes the cost of replacing the old 100 amp Zinsco electrical panel with a 200 amp panel. That is valued separately at $2000 (based on independent quotes I have received, and that's how much they are charging for it as well). Subtracting the panel cost, it's $4.34 and $2.73 per watt.

Because of limited optimal facing roof space I needed to use the more expensive, more efficient, Sunpower panels. I got four quotes. Two used inferior panels. One used panels from a company that is in some financial trouble (and even though those panels are monocrystalline they are not very efficient) and I was hesitant to go with them. Some of the proposals from the companies using sub-300 watt panels were almost comical--there were panels scattered everywhere on the roof just to get up to 5000-6000 watts.

It's not installed yet and I still have time to cancel if something better comes up.

I got estimates from Sunrun, Peterson-Dean, Sunpower, and Solar City. Sunrun's panels were too low wattage. Peterson-Dean uses Solar World panels and I was uneasy about the prospects for Solar World. Solar City is essentially selling financing and they really only want to do leases. Plus Petersen Dean is doing infomercials now and that makes me leery.

So this is what I've learned so far after talking to multiple salespeople (only one of which really knew very much).

1. Avoid micro-inverters if a) you have a tile roof, or b) you live in a hot area. Too many points of failure and you don't want people constantly on your roof replacing them (especially on a tile roof). If a central inverter fails it's an easy replacement.
2. Optimizers are not necessary unless you have shading issues or are really into monitoring each panel's production.
3. For residential use get monocrystalline panels. Avoid polycrystalline panels.
4. Don't buy panels that are less than 300 watts each. Some older-technology monocrystalline panels are low wattage, and nearly all polycrystalline panels are low wattage. Low wattage panel are fine for huge installations with lots of available area and the lower cost per watt makes sense in that situation.
5. Buy direct, from a panel manufacturer that is likely to remain in business, not from an independent solar installer that sells panels from that manufacturer. Also avoid companies that have latched onto solar as a sideline, i.e. replacement window companies, roofers, etc..
6. Minimize the number of panels buy using the more efficient panels even if the initial cost is slightly higher.
7. Buy, don't lease, and avoid "prepaid power agreements." Whatever they don't want to sell you is probably what you want to buy.
8. Ensure that the electrical panel upgrade cost, if necessary is included. If you do it as part of the installation you get the tax credit on the electrical panel.
9. After 2015 the 30% federal tax credit is being phased out over several years with declining percentages..
10. Check LinkedIn for friends that may work at a solar company to see if there is any "friend's and family" discount (the quote I got from Sunpower came down by $3000 because of a 60¢/KW credit, without that credit I probably would have not done solar at all).
11. Check that it makes sense at all based on your KWH rate. At PG&E's 33¢/KWH it makes sense for me. The next city over, Santa Clara, with a municipally owned power company, charges about 11¢/KWH and solar makes no sense.
12. Consider whether or not a time-of-use rate plan will work for you or not. For my utility, they credit you a lot more for generated power if you are on a time-of-use rate plan, so even if you have to use some peak time power, i.e. for a pool pump or air conditioner, it may be beneficial to be on the time-of use plan and pay a higher peak rate than on a non-time-of-use rate plan.
13. Avoid the one-year-same-as-cash offers if the company takes credit cards. A 2% credit card rebate (Citibank Double Cash) is a lot better than one year of free financing considering the nearly 0% interest rates banks are paying on savings.
14. The cheapest quote is usually not the best quote. Especially important to consider is what is going to happen to these smaller installers once the federal tax credit goes away. And what's going to happen to panel manufacturers in the U.S. once the anti-dumping penalties are reduced or eliminated.

[wshepherd]

With 78 panels, I'm going to guess you really mean

"$104,423 for a 19.89 KW system from Solar City ($5,250 per KW)"

yes

[wshepherd]

Follow up question

I paid $4.23 before incentives ($2.25 after) for the following 7.8kW system installed including cost of trenching 100' and under a driveway. The install location is in Connecticut.

(24) SunPower 327 panels
SMA SB7000TL-22 with SPS Outlet.

Roof installed on detached barn

Would you mind sharing who your installer was?

[araghava]

Araghava.

Great job on your system, with investigation, vendor selection and price too - I think you meant $3.00 per Watt.

As posted before (a fellow from Scotland) the electrician based company provided the best value/$ versus buying from a "solar company" specializing in the field.

Yes, thanks for catching that. I edited my original post.

[Carl_NH]

3$/Kw pre tax, San Francisco.
3.6 Kw system
Renesola Panels
SolarEdge Inverter

Araghava.

Great job on your system, with investigation, vendor selection and price too - I think you meant $3.00 per Watt.

As posted before (a fellow from Scotland) the electrician based company provided the best value/$ versus buying from a "solar company" specializing in the field.

[araghava]

3$/W pre tax, San Francisco.
3.6 Kw system
Renesola Panels
SolarEdge Inverter

[J.P.M.]

Yes one vendor not the same as alisobob.

Thank you.

[bam_bam]

one vendor

One vendor ? Same as AlisoBob ?

Yes one vendor not the same as alisobob.

[bcroe]

Getting a quote for 104,423 for a 19,890 KW system from Solar City ($5.25 per KW)

78 Trina Solar 255PD05.18 panels Any thoughts on this?

With 78 panels, I'm going to guess you really mean

"$104,423 for a 19.89 KW system from Solar City ($5,250 per KW)"

[J.P.M.]

Getting a quote for 104,423 for a 19,890 KW system from Solar City ($5.25 per KW), before subsidies. Location is Greenwich, CT.

78 Trina Solar 255PD05.18 panels
SolarEdge Inverter SE7600A-US-ZB-U
SolarEdge Inverter SE10000A-US-ZB-U
all installation included

30 year guarantee, first year production at 20KWH, last year production at 17.5KWH
I think they replace the inverters for free somewhere between year 10-15 based on their lifespan

This seems high to me, even given the northeast location.

Any thoughts on this? (Anyone want to bid for the business?)

I'm ignorant of pricing in CT, but for a decent system with nothing/little unusual about the install, that would be high for CA. Also, depending on orientation and shading, the estimated output may be a bit on the low side.

[wshepherd]

Does this price make sense?

Getting a quote for 104,423 for a 19,890 KW system from Solar City ($5.25 per KW), before subsidies. Location is Greenwich, CT.

78 Trina Solar 255PD05.18 panels
SolarEdge Inverter SE7600A-US-ZB-U
SolarEdge Inverter SE10000A-US-ZB-U
all installation included

30 year guarantee, first year production at 20KWH, last year production at 17.5KWH
I think they replace the inverters for free somewhere between year 10-15 based on their lifespan

This seems high to me, even given the northeast location.

Any thoughts on this? (Anyone want to bid for the business?)

[SoCalsolar]

bam

pm sent

[bam_bam]

Roof

What type of roof? Size of your main panel?

Cement tile roof two story and I am not at home but they said the box is large and easy to connect too. Home was built 2006