41.3kW DIY Solar Panel Install on 4 houses

[khanh dam]

If any Inverter manufacturer goes out of business or gets sold next week you are screwed.

if they are part of the sunspec alliance that guarantees compatability between inverter and RSD units under each solar panel, then you just have to replace the inverter. With SolarEdge you have to take off every panel and replace the optimizer/RSD because they are propritary and only work with their propritary inverter was my point. A $2000 labor job now becomes a $5000 labor job.

it can literally make the solar install go from profitable to in the RED because one invested in propritary gear vs an open source standard.

Also micro inverters are a little more flexible in this regard since potentially a different brand could be installed, under a few panels.

[SunEagle]

I don't think warranties matter that much myself since big stable companies find easy ways to invalidate warranties when they become too expensive to honor. They don't worry all that much about backwards compatibility either, just buy a whole new system. I feel people put far too much weight behind long-term warranties and what-if situations when making buying decisions. Look at the recent GM cracked wheel lawsuits. GM says the warranty only covers defects in the materials, but not a defect in the their engineers failure to design a proper part. Embarrassing but true.

You are correct. The big company attorneys will always have the upper hand. Warranties are almost useless.

[azdave]

Too bad there really aren't any solar hardware companies that have a guarantee to be around for as long as Ford, Chevy or Dodge have been.

I don't think warranties matter that much myself since big stable companies find easy ways to invalidate warranties when they become too expensive to honor. They don't worry all that much about backwards compatibility either, just buy a whole new system. I feel people put far too much weight behind long-term warranties and what-if situations when making buying decisions. Look at the recent GM cracked wheel lawsuits. GM says the warranty only covers defects in the materials, but not a defect in the their engineers failure to design a proper part. Embarrassing but true.

[SunEagle]

If any Inverter manufacturer goes out of business or gets sold next week you are screwed. Life has risks. Twelve years ago i bought a Xantrex inverter. When it quit three years ago I replaced it with a Solaredge because i already had Solaredge on another building and it has worked fine. It all depends on where you are standing.

Too bad there really aren't any solar hardware companies that have a guarantee to be around for as long as Ford, Chevy or Dodge have been.

[Ampster]

solar edge is a horrible inverter that uses propritary optimizers. if they go out of business 9 years from now you are screwed if you ever need replacement parts.

If any Inverter manufacturer goes out of business or gets sold next week you are screwed. Life has risks. Twelve years ago i bought a Xantrex inverter. When it quit three years ago I replaced it with a Solaredge because i already had Solaredge on another building and it has worked fine. It all depends on where you are standing.

[khanh dam]

solar edge is a horrible inverter that uses propritary optimizers. if they go out of business 9 years from now you are screwed if you ever need replacement parts.

[oregon_phil]

Next time, ask your questions about optimizers or other issues on the forum. I would have told you to look up the Inverter comparability guide on the TIGO website. As you found out, the Tigo TS4-R-O were being obsoleted. The TIGO compatibility list shows this is being replaced by TS4-A-O and does work with the -41 inverter. It's just that SMA does not promote this on their website.

[MaxThisPower]

I can't believe it but I made a big mistake. Fortunately I caught it before the vendor shipped out the inverter. The kit ordered was SMA SunnyBoy with TS4-R-F optimizer which turns out isn't really an optimizer. It's just a rapid shutdown.

After spending several weeks trying to determine how to get optimizers to work with SunnyBoy I just gave up and ordered SolarEdge instead.

[MaxThisPower]

My permit was approved. I think the firefighters are able to get on my roof without the needing the 3' setback. I did call the local fire department and they basically said they didn't really care where the panels are located; that's more of a city code.

[foo1bar]

Sounds like you know what you are doing. Unfortunately I'm just a layman when it comes to solar that's why I'm going with a kit but I can see how quickly your time would add up if you researched all the equipment.

I know a lot more now, after doing a lot of reading and doing my install.
I also essentially "went with a kit".
Much of that research was part of determining which kits were good choices for my purpose.
And if you haven't realized it already, the "kit" these vendors have is really only a starting point. Most likely you will want to change it to suit your needs. And the vendors I've dealt with are fine with that - the "kit" is just a starting point for a list of materials - they are fine with adding/subtracting items from your BoM to fit your project. And when I was pricing things out for my build, I found that there was no discount that you get because you're buying a "kit". If you bought the same set of items piecemeal you would usually get the same price at the vendor that had them as a "kit" - and in the few cases that I didn't find that, I could get all the components at a different vendor for cheaper

I couldn't find any manuals where it stated the bus bar amperage so I'm assuming it's just 100a.

If you can find a model number on the breaker box, possibly you can look up the model and find documentation for it.

Personally, I had an old Federal Pacific fire hazard, I mean electrical panel as my main panel, so the solar installation was a very good time to replace it.

[bob-n]

Max,

You're obviously smart. Don't sell yourself short.

Please understand that kit is the easy part. Any dealer will sell you a turn-key package. Getting the right package for your needs is a bit harder. That's why it is important to figure out what you need.

The details about your house and your electrical system are also critical. The dealer and the kit won't solve that either.

Going to the fire department is a good idea. Another idea is to find your town building inspector. They have a more general knowledge of these things and can give you advice on electrical, setback and other requirements.

Each town seems to have their own standards for setback. But busbar requirements are specified in the national electric code (NEC) and specifications are in the circuit breaker box (load center, service panel). Find the model number, call the manufacturer or a stocking dealer, and ask.

[MaxThisPower]

* researching what type of inverter
* researching what type of rails
* measuring roof planes and vent locations so that I could determine panel locations
* researching grounding requirements
* researching wiring and conduit
* researching potential suppliers
* getting pricing info from potential suppliers

Sounds like you know what you are doing. Unfortunately I'm just a layman when it comes to solar that's why I'm going with a kit but I can see how quickly your time would add up if you researched all the equipment.

* creating documents for building permit
* learning about 3' setback rule
* meeting with fire dept. for waiver to 3' setback rule on part of my design
* meeting with building dept for permit review

As for the 3' setback, I read in one of the city's solar documentation that if you can't have the setback than there could be exceptions on a case by case but who approves the exception I don't know. Just to be on the safe side, I'll call the fire department and ask about it.

BTW - have you confirmed that the panel you have currently is a 100A busbar?

I couldn't find any manuals where it stated the bus bar amperage so I'm assuming it's just 100a.

PS Ouch that hurt

[foo1bar]

BTW - have you confirmed that the panel you have currently is a 100A busbar?
Because there are a number of panels that are 100A main breaker and 125A busbar.
125A * 1.2 - 100A = 50A available (which would be a 9.6kW AC system)

While I don't know your building dept - for my AHJ, I could do all the work under 1 permit - any subcontractor I hired out needed to be licensed subcontractor, but I could pull a single permit for all the work being done, including anything I hired a subcontractor for.

Also, I doubt you can get a Tesla solar system for $1.50/W, even after tax credit (especially with the extra $1600 for upgrading the main panel)


PS the background music on your video makes me want to reach through the monitor and smack you upside the head.

[foo1bar]

So far I've spent 23 hours and I haven't even ordered the panels yet. Does it normally take that long to do all the prep work?

I spent way more time than that before ordering panels.

* researching what type of inverter
* researching what type of rails
* measuring roof planes and vent locations so that I could determine panel locations
* researching grounding requirements
* researching wiring and conduit
* researching potential suppliers
* getting pricing info from potential suppliers
* creating documents for building permit
* learning about 3' setback rule
* meeting with fire dept. for waiver to 3' setback rule on part of my design
* meeting with building dept for permit review

[MaxThisPower]

I just received my documents I need to get a permit from the vendor however they don't create the site map so I had to spend several hours learning how to create one.That was a nice learning experience.

So far I've spent 23 hours and I haven't even ordered the panels yet. Does it normally take that long to do all the prep work?