Is Sunpower price difference worth it? -- thoughts, posting as new topic

[Yaryman]

You mean 9% more energy per nameplate watt per year?
Energy per watt is a somewhat strange description.

Straight from the ad.

"70% more energy in the same space over 25 years1"

"1. SunPower 345W compared to a Conventional Panel (250W, 15.3% efficient, approx. 1.6 m2), 9% more energy per watt, 0.75%/yr slower degradation. BEW/DNV Engineering "SunPower Yield Report," Jan 2013, with CFV Solar Test Lab Report #12063, Jan 2013 temp. coef. calculation. Campeau, Z. et al. "SunPower Module Degradation Rate," SunPower white paper, Feb 2013. Seewww.sunpowercorp.com/facts for details."

If you saw a Ferrari ad that claimed -

"70% more speed on the same road1"
1. Ferrari produces 70% more speed on the same road when compared to an economy priced Kia.

You would know it was bullsh*t.

Why isn't is BS when Sunpower does it?

[cebury]

LOL

Really 75% is conservative.

Guaranteed degradation for a Lease is .25% LG average degredation (http://www.lg.com/us/commercial/sola...lg-LG360N2W-B3) is .6%= .35% difference
8% more energy per rated watt (SP rates their panels at 8% less than their actual production)
No light induced degredation = 2% more from day one

All added up: .35%+2%+8%=10.35%

10.35% * 20 years for the typical SunPower Lease= 207% more for the same size system if you really want to get serious about it.

Wow math really wasn't in his toolbox, ha. His employer should give him a 1% raise this year, because it's really a 20% raise if he stays long enough.

Kicked account in a short few hours, that was fast.

[sunnyguy]

This is what they are really claiming, best case against a crappy 15% panel:

SunPower X-Series solar panels produce 21% more energy per rated watt over the first 25 years

It will not be that good compared to something like LG neon.

[inetdog]

It mentions 9% more energy per watt.

You mean 9% more energy per nameplate watt per year?
Energy per watt is a somewhat strange description.

[Yaryman]

It's right there in the bottom of the photo I posted.

Sunpower 345W compared to Conventional 250W panel. It mentions 9% more energy per watt. That's OK.

But the problem is, SunPower is CHARGING way MORE than 9% per watt for their panels.

[inetdog]

How much smaller is the comparison panel?

[Yaryman]

inetdog,

Really, you are telling me they are not trying to be deceptive.

70% more energy in the same space.

When the truth would be more like this.

70% more energy when compared to a smaller sized panel of a lesser quality and cost in the same space.

When somebody has to bullsh*t you to prove their product is worth the extra money, most likely it's not.

[inetdog]

It is completely honest, in that the higher output SP panel fits in the same space on the roof as the lower power panel.
You just have to recognize that is what they are sayin.
But for most people price per watt is more important.

[Yaryman]

This is an ad from the company that makes the best panel and has an amazing "misleading" ad.

They compare a 345 watt panel with a 250 watt panel, put that information in the fine print, and then claim 70% better production.

Really??




sunpower.jpg

[ButchDeal]

LOL

Really 75% is conservative.

Guaranteed degradation for a Lease is .25% LG average degredation (http://www.lg.com/us/commercial/sola...lg-LG360N2W-B3) is .6%= .35% difference
8% more energy per rated watt (SP rates their panels at 8% less than their actual production)
No light induced degredation = 2% more from day one

All added up: .35%+2%+8%=10.35%

10.35% * 20 years for the typical SunPower Lease= 207% more for the same size system if you really want to get serious about it. But that is so incredible why say it to begin with when people dont even believe 75%.

Soooo you are in sales I guess. Well that isn't how math works there guy. Go sell your yellow primer someplace else.

[sunnyguy]

10.35% * 20 years for the typical SunPower Lease= 207%

inetdog called it and you still fell for it. That is not how math works.

i guess we know how these leasing companies are getting people to sign for sunpower systems now.

[inetdog]

LOL

Really 75% is conservative.

Guaranteed degradation for a Lease is .25% LG average degredation (http://www.lg.com/us/commercial/sola...lg-LG360N2W-B3) is .6%= .35% difference
8% more energy per rated watt (SP rates their panels at 8% less than their actual production)
No light induced degredation = 2% more from day one

All added up: .35%+2%+8%=10.35%

10.35% * 20 years for the typical SunPower Lease= 207% more for the same size system if you really want to get serious about it. But that is so incredible why say it to begin with when people dont even believe 75%.

https://www.sunpower.com/home-solar

https://www.seabrightsolar.com

https://www.socalfreesolarestimate.com

You are actually doing it! And I was just trying to make a joke.

You are saying that from day one the SP panels produce 8% more power than another panel of the same rating.
That means that over the 20 year lifetime the SP panel producs 8% more power than the other panel. Multiplying the 8% by 20 tells you that over the course of 20 years the excess is 160% of ONE YEAR'S production, not that the total 20 year production is 160% greater.
Now when you look at the degradation, that will be 20 times as great at the end of 20 years (which means that the average degradation seen over the 20 year period will be ten times the single year figure, by the way.)
Your numbers do not mean what you think they mean and therefore do not make any sense.

LOL

Really 75% is conservative.

Guaranteed degradation for a Lease is .25% LG average degredation (http://www.lg.com/us/commercial/sola...lg-LG360N2W-B3) is .6%= .35% difference
8% more energy per rated watt (SP rates their panels at 8% less than their actual production)
No light induced degredation = 2% more from day one

All added up: .35%+2%+8%=10.35%

10.35% * 20 years for the typical SunPower Lease= 207% more for the same size system if you really want to get serious about it. But that is so incredible why say it to begin with when people dont even believe 75%.

http://www.solarreviews.com/manufacturers/sunpower/

http://www.solarreviews.com/installers/sea-bright-solar-reviews/

Admin note, I got changed a couple of urls, is this an example of the caliber of the solar sales reps? Seems to have fallen for the marketing guff

[inetdog]

what a pile of crap. 75% more over the lifetime, You got some proof on that one!? Take you BS crap someplace else.

You mean 7% more per year over ten years does not equal 70%?

[ButchDeal]

Really, if given a reasonable estimate for sunpower, which for a 3kW-5kW system is around $4.40-4.60 per watt and $4.10-$4.30/watt for 6kW-9kW and $3.90-$4.10 for 10kW+ systems, the price difference IS worth it. You will get 75% more energy over the lifetime of the panels. 8% more per rated watt, the degradation rate for Sunpower is actually only 33% of or 3 times better than the LG panels. You'll use, in your case, 1 less panel. I'd take a hard look at the extended production guarantee on the LG proposal before you go forward with it. If you need any more info I'd be glad to help.

what a pile of crap. 75% more over the lifetime, You got some proof on that one!? Take you BS crap someplace else.