Inverter fault

[Ampster]

I was confusing the terminology we are on a TOUB. Vivent installed the new system along side our old we have both now totaling 12kWh. I will verify what peak rate Vivint has us set on. So I’m on TOUB and 12 kWh should cover our 10kwh average usage?

No Worries. This stuff is confusing and PG&E doesn't make it any clearer on their bill. Although that summary your posted will be the most meaningful indication of how you are doing during the next year.
It is important to distinguish system size in kW and consumption in kWhs. That figure of 10kWhrs was just an average in June after generation.
Here are some general assumptions for planning purposes that use assumptions about annual consumption and generation.
Using a rough rule of thumb that you might get 1500 kwhs for every kW of installed solar panel capacity you might be able to generate 18,000 kWhrs in a year from the 12 kWs of panels that you have now installed. Last year you consumed 12,000 kWhs after approximately 3,000kWhs from your old system so it looks like you should net out at zero net consumption for the year. That doesn't mean you bill will be zero because of Minimum delivery charges and payments to Vivint. As I mentioned in my earlier post you should be able to reduce your peak hour bill to zero and generate a credit without stressing your battery. At this point the baseline allowance should not be a factor. Unless I had hourly detail about your consumption I would not even be able to guess which rate plan would be best. I drive and charge two EVs so my rate choices are different and my consumption is skewed to picking the plan with the least expensive super off peak rates.

The Sunrun acquisition of Vivint closed four months ago and the earlier issues you experienced may be partly due to that transition. Hopefully the system meets your expectations.

[Veger70]

The attachment says TOUB which according to my information says no baseline allowance so that is a moot point unless you have more recent information. Have you changed rate plans? You can log onto your account at PGE and verify which plan you are on today. It is on the right hand side after you log on to your account.
I see that you previously had a 2kW system that did not generate enough to offset usage during the highest solar generation time in June-July.
Did Vivint give you and estimate of production on a monthly basis? I would start there or go to pvwatts and get one for your system and see if it will generate enough to cover the consumption shown in your chart.
The most important thing to start with is to confirm that Vivint has the correct peak rate period entered into your system. Then they should be able to tell you if your system has enough capacity and can be programmed to cover your usage during those peak rate periods and how much of the off peak usage. Just looking at your data your new system should be able to knock off the all of the 10 kWhrs average of peak daily usage in June and some of the off peak usage.

I was confusing the terminology we are on a TOUB. Vivent installed the new system along side our old we have both now totaling 12kWh. I will verify what peak rate Vivint has us set on. So I’m on TOUB and 12 kWh should cover our 10kwh average usage?

[Ampster]

we are on a TOU-C as shown below. Could you explain why the TOC allowance could be a reason it would be beneficial to me to use maximum consumption?

The attachment says TOUB which according to my information says no baseline allowance so that is a moot point unless you have more recent information. Have you changed rate plans? You can log onto your account at PGE and verify which plan you are on today. It is on the right hand side after you log on to your account.
I see that you previously had a 2kW system that did not generate enough to offset usage during the highest solar generation time in June-July.
Did Vivint give you an estimate of production on a monthly basis? I would start there or go to pvwatts and get one for your system and see if it will generate enough to cover the consumption shown in your chart.
The most important thing to start with is to confirm that Vivint has the correct peak rate period entered into your system. Then they should be able to tell you if your system has enough capacity and can be programmed to cover your usage during those peak rate periods and how much of the off peak usage. Just looking at your data your new system should be able to knock off the all of the 10 kWhrs average of peak daily usage in June and some of the off peak usage.

[Veger70]

An earlier post suggested to me that they may have made an assumption that you were on a different rate schedule. Also TOU-C does have a baseline allowance and that would be a good reason, as @Soby suggested, to program the inverter for maximum self consumption. It should be your choice about how much reserve to keep for backup. Since you are leasing the system, you should not worry about wearing out the battery. That is between Vivent and LG Chem.

we are on a TOU-C as shown below. Could you explain why the TOC allowance could be a reason it would be beneficial to me to use maximum consumption?

1C6F49D9-8964-46C7-AC20-4C38688AD5B0.jpeg

[Ampster]

Vivint didn’t say they don’t know how to program it, they said I cannot have access to the SolarEdge monitoring software. They are putting me in contact with a “specialist” lol by Wednesday we will see.
I'm assuming it has to do with SolarEdge Charge/Discharge Modes as shown on page 40 of this https://www.solaredge.com/sites/defa...n_guide_na.pdf
I’m hopping someone has knowledge of configuring these profiles to maximize battery use for peak times so I can speak to the tech’s from a place of knowledge rather than relying on them to tell what’s possible.

I may have misunderstood about them knowing how to program.

In response to one of your earlier questions, you should tell them that you are on PG&E TOU-C and what the peak rate period is that applies to that schedule. An earlier post suggested to me that they may have made an assumption that you were on a different rate schedule. Also TOU-C does have a baseline allowance and that would be a good reason, as @Soby suggested, to program the inverter for maximum self consumption. It should be your choice about how much reserve to keep for backup. Since you are leasing the system, you should not worry about wearing out the battery. That is between Vivent and LG Chem.

That PDF is a good read and together with the advice you previously got from @Soby you should have everything you need to have a good discussion with the tech. If you need any help understanding the PG&E bill and how the SCP portion relates to that, I may be able to help. For simplicity you can just use the PG&E rates on the first few pages of your bill and know that you are saving money with SCP. On an ongoing basis track your net consumption and the running estimate of your True Up estimate which appears on each monthly bill. Also, know that the rates will change and the time periods will shift as well over time.

[Veger70]

Perhaps there is a separate programing manual. I was responding to your statement that Vivint did not know how to program it. I am just trying to apply general problem solving methods to your issue. I don't have any more ideas except what I suggested earlier about using an Internet search to find someone who may have found a solution to your issue.

The Solaredge site has lots of information. I only have their GT models and yes the programming is much easier via the web.

Vivint didn’t say they don’t know how to program it, they said I cannot have access to the SolarEdge monitoring software. They are putting me in contact with a “specialist” lol by Wednesday we will see.
I'm assuming it has to do with SolarEdge Charge/Discharge Modes as shown on page 40 of this https://www.solaredge.com/sites/defa...n_guide_na.pdf
I’m hopping someone has knowledge of configuring these profiles to maximize battery use for peak times so I can speak to the tech’s from a place of knowledge rather than relying on them to tell what’s possible.

[Ampster]

Perhaps there is a separate programing manual. I was responding to your statement that Vivint did not know how to program it. I am just trying to apply general problem solving methods to your issue. I don't have any more ideas except what I suggested earlier about using an Internet search to find someone who may have found a solution to your issue.

The Solaredge site has lots of information. I only have their GT models and yes the programming is much easier via the web.

[Veger70]

You appear to be on TOU-C which has a baseline allowance. The only way to tell if that is better than TOU-C is to estimate how close you will come to that allowance. So far no one here has offered any experience with programming a Solaredge inverter with LG Chem batteries. All I can presume is that the inverter is a Storedge model and that the programming is done with the inverter interface.
I have no experience with that model but if you don't have the manual, it can be downloaded. At least that would give you a sense for how it can be programmed. Then you could quote parts of the manual to tell them how to do it. Also a few well crafted searches on the Internet may give you a better way to approach Vivent for access to programming the inverter to optimize what you are paying for. They are part of Sunrun now.

The inverter is a INVERTER - (2) SolarEdge Technologies SE7600A-USS2RNCY2
so you don’t use the SolarEdge website to program the inverter? Is it done manually at the inverter? I downloaded the manual and it only has installation info and how to communicate with the inverter no information on programming it.

[Ampster]

You appear to be on TOU-C which has a baseline allowance. The only way to tell if that is better than TOU-C is to estimate how close you will come to that allowance. So far no one here has offered any experience with programming a Solaredge inverter with LG Chem batteries. All I can presume is that the inverter is a Storedge model and that the programming is done with the inverter interface.
I have no experience with that model but if you don't have the manual, it can be downloaded. At least that would give you a sense for how it can be programmed. Then you could quote parts of the manual to tell them how to do it. Also a few well crafted searches on the Internet may give you a better way to approach Vivent for access to programming the inverter to optimize what you are paying for. They are part of Sunrun now.

[Veger70]

Since Vivent is only charging you for solar production not battery consumption, do they allow any configuration of the battery? Have your TOU rate periods been entered?
Try searching the Internet for Vivent user groups or videos.
The knowledge base here would have provided you good input to NOT enter into a Vivent lease. Now you need expertise on how to make the most of a battery system. I am familiar with PG&E and SCP and can answer questions about how to understand your bills and how to strategize your battery usage but I am not familiar with the subleties of configuring a Vivent system. I am familiar with Solaredge monitoring and can tell you that the answer you got from Vivent is BS. The first thing I would focus on is configurung your system to use the battery during your peak rate time period. Do you know which rate you are on? It should say on your PG&E bill.

Vivint doesn’t have a system they use SolarEdge. They just refuse to give us access. I listed the rates above under PG&E NEM Agreement, but here it is again:

PG&E NEM agreement
Peak 0.26567
Off 0.24678

Sonoma Clean Power Generation charges
Peak 0.09
Off 0.07
PG&E peak rates are M-F 4-9PM. All other Off

so any help telling them how to configure SolarEdge to maximize battery use would be great!

The tech said he updated the software on the LG battery that wasn’t working now it shows the green on symbol but is not charging/discharging.

[Ampster]

Since Vivent is only charging you for solar production not battery consumption, do they allow any configuration of the battery? Have your TOU rate periods been entered?
Try searching the Internet for Vivent user groups or videos.
The knowledge base here would have provided you good input to NOT enter into a Vivent lease. Now you need expertise on how to make the most of a battery system. I am familiar with PG&E and SCP and can answer questions about how to understand your bills and how to strategize your battery usage but I am not familiar with the subleties of configuring a Vivent system. I am familiar with Solaredge monitoring and can tell you that the answer you got from Vivent is BS. The first thing I would focus on is configurung your system to use the battery during your peak rate time period. Do you know which rate you are on? It should say on your PG&E bill.

[Veger70]

Only charging one battery make sense, since only one has the charging/discharging light on the front and the other the green on light. I’ll have to contact service again.

Below is the production/consumption rates from the 13th. Looks like Vivint is discharging the battery at from 5:00 to 7:00. By 4PM we are back to drawing from the grid again which makes no sense since PG&E peak rates are M-F 4-9PM. Why wouldn’t they run it off the batteries from 4-9?




PG&E NEM agreement
Peak 0.26567
Off 0.24678

Sonoma Clean Power
Peak 0.09
Off. 0.07

Since we are leasing the solar system from Vivint we pay Vivint 0.21 per kWh for solar energy produced on there system.
I was so happy to get solar with no money out of pocket with batteries since the power outages from fires were so bad up in Santa Rosa that I didn’t think to ask on here before we signed the contract.
6A12D2B3-63BD-4C2D-8E38-EB880EA177BA.jpeg

[Ampster]

I agree with what @soby says. Since you are in PG&E territory with Sonoma Clean Power, you have probably have experienced the same PG&E outages which I have experienced. Be glad your battery is probably programmed for some reserve for backup because you never know when you will need it. I am on an EV rate so I may have different rate choices than your but the two differences between the A and B rates are the time periods for peak and the lower rate for lower usage of one choice. It is all on the PG&E website and there is a rate analysis tool that may help you decide which rate is the best.

There are third party monitoring apps and tools that can give you some insight if you can not get the data from Vivent.
EDIT: Reading earlier posts from this thread it looks like you are getting reasonable information from Vivent.

[soby]

So I guess I’m not going to get the ability to access the SolarEdge site. “Maximize Self-Consumption” mode per SolarEdge info is for “charging the battery from the PV/grid when tariffs are low and discharge the battery when tariffs are high” can you explain what i need to look for if I’m with Sonoma Clean Power or would I have to look at PG&E to get the rates? I’m not sure Vivint cares enough to be worried about this but if there’s a better mode to save money I’ll tell them

At a basic level, net metering allows you to use the utility company as a battery. If you generate more power than you use during the day, the utility company stores it for you and you can draw from it later. To combat this, utility companies can make Time of Use rate structure so that the power you feed the grid during the day is less valuable than the power you use at night.

Having your own on-site battery allows you to store a portion of your daytime generation for use later in the day when you'd otherwise be drawing from the grid. This can be advantagous if you discover that your electricity is most expensive at 7pm, for example. You can charge up your battery during the daytime when the utility company wont credit you as much and then program your battery to discharge the battery starting at 7pm.

It sounds like your batteries are programmed to immediately discharge the battery to meet your demand as the sun goes down. Unless you are saving money by charging and discharging your batteries fully every day, this is unnecessary wear and tear that will shorten the life of the batteries for no good reason.

My current setup with one inverter and one 9.8kWh battery has a backup reserve of 50% and is set to charge only via clipped solar (inverter output above 8kW AC). This configuration harvests energy that would otherwise be lost. Some days, especially during the winter, it doesn't charge at all because the sun isn't intense enough. Other days, it will charge it to 100% for essentially free. I then have it configured to use the stored energy to meet the household demand starting at 1am. Since household use is usually very low at that time, the battery discharges nice and slow. LG recommends staying under 3.3kW charging or discharging.

For your setup, find out if your utility company has a flat rate all the time or if it changes. That will determine if there is any benefit to "time-shifting" your solar generation to save money.

In regards to the 7.49kWh to charge your battery, that sounds like the energy needed to charge just one of the batteries. Since you have two inverters with one battery each, how does the monitoring differentiate between the two inverters?

[Ampster]

............ can you explain what i need to look for if I’m with Sonoma Clean Power or would I have to look at PG&E to get the rates? ........

All the information is on your PG&E bill. They do the billing for Sonoma Clean Power. I don't know which kind of billing you have. If you got SGIP rebate you may get something like a "paired storage' bill that does not look like the regular bill which I get. Also if you are on a paired storage plan, you should be aware that PG&E does monitor your bill against expected generation to make sure you are not selling more power than your system could generate.

Your best strategy would be first to understand the rate periods and use your battery to shift your loads away from from the peak periods and generate credits during peak and mid peak to offset usage. There is no economic incentive at the end of True Up to have a big credit.