TOU calculator

[josefontao]

So SCE just forced me to TOU-4-9pm, which is a rip off compared to TOU-D-A which is what i used to have up until last month. I've been paying around $300/year. With the new rates it will be way over $1000. maybe $1500.
I did not receive the letter from SCE with the proposed changes, or if I did, I threw it away without reading it.
This is such a rip off. WOW.

Does anyone have a nice calculator to plug in the numbers and see what plan makes more sense? At first glance TOU-PRIME seems to be cheaper that 4-9PM despite not having the baseline allocation credit and the much higher basic charge. But I would like to plug in the numbers and see.
I used to have an old spreadsheet from someone in the group, but this was years ago before I got my panels and things have changed a lot since.

Any help is appreciated.

[josefontao]

Also, with all these new changes from SCE, do we still get credits when we overproduce or that went away too? Cause i cant find any info on this.

[Ampster]

Also, with all these new changes from SCE, do we still get credits when we overproduce or that went away too? Cause i cant find any info on this.

Which changes are you referring to? There is a Proposed Tariff (NEM 3.0) which is scheduled to be voted on in late January.

[josefontao]

Which changes are you referring to? There is a Proposed Tariff (NEM 3.0) which is scheduled to be voted on in late January.

The switch from TOU-DA to TOU-4-9PM. But yeah, also the upcoming vote on the 27th. Bottom line, do we still get credit for overproducing at the same usage rate?

[Ampster]

The changes in rates happen several times a year. You would have to look at your bill to see how your current rate compares to past rates. It is hard to predict what is going to happen on the 27th. When was your NEM agreement dated? If the tariff is approved you may have 15 years from that date before the proposed changes affect you.

[OftheSeven]

The switch from TOU-DA to TOU-4-9PM. But yeah, also the upcoming vote on the 27th. Bottom line, do we still get credit for overproducing at the same usage rate?

Hi Jose - I was just looking back at our old emails from 2015 when we first got solar and was curious what you ended up with...

Yeah, this elimination of TOU-D-A sucks. I didn't check all the numbers but it doesn't appear we're getting the same credits as before for overproduction.
I ended up switching to Domestic Tiered and it seems to be the least painful of the choices for now. The estimates they sent are based on 'net usage' so I don't know how they account for overproducing. The numbers they sent me were:

TOU-D-A $221/year
TOU-D-4-9 $967
TOU-D-5-8 $1020
TOU-DPrime $1071
Domestic $833

You can call (866) 678-7964 to discuss with SCE.

If we truly are grandfathered into the NEM credit rates then maybe TOU-D 4-9 might work out?
For now, I'm starting to charge my EVs during the day while I produce to reduce overall usage.

[J.P.M.]

Hi Jose - I was just looking back at our old emails from 2015 when we first got solar and was curious what you ended up with...

Yeah, this elimination of TOU-D-A sucks. I didn't check all the numbers but it doesn't appear we're getting the same credits as before for overproduction.
I ended up switching to Domestic Tiered and it seems to be the least painful of the choices for now. The estimates they sent are based on 'net usage' so I don't know how they account for overproducing. The numbers they sent me were:

TOU-D-A $221/year
TOU-D-4-9 $967
TOU-D-5-8 $1020
TOU-DPrime $1071
Domestic $833

You can call (866) 678-7964 to discuss with SCE.

If we truly are grandfathered into the NEM credit rates then maybe TOU-D 4-9 might work out?
For now, I'm starting to charge my EVs during the day while I produce to reduce overall usage.

Per the CPUC website, as of 02/03/2022, an administrative law judge has postponed the scheduled CPUC vote on NEM 3.0 indefinitely. See the website for details.

[silversaver]

You really don't need any calculator since you cannot sell high and buy low anymore as TOU-D-A, I used to withdraw 6-7k kWh from SCE and pay nothing while enjoy 2 EVs. Tier plan probably better pick than any of TOU plans unless you have huge power demand as EVs. If SCE paying you the same rate as they charges you, your solar production is still minimum after 4pm. You will end up paying lot higher rate during peak hours.

[Ampster]

.......

If we truly are grandfathered into the NEM credit rates then maybe TOU-D 4-9 might work out?
For now, I'm starting to charge my EVs during the day while I produce to reduce overall usage.

There is no grandfathering of rates. Some rate plans are grandfathered for those that got in before they were superceeded by less favorable rate plans. My old EV rate still had rate increases but the differentials were more favorable than the new one. I lost the old rate plan when I moved to a different home.
NEM is not a rate plan at all. It is a compensation method and has some semblance of grandfathering to it.

Rates and time periods for those rates have eroded the benefits so much that I am sometimes charging my EVs during the day as well.

[oldguy]

OP never responded to PTO date but based on his join date he's probably a NEM 1.0 guy. I wish I was NEM 1.0! I was also crunched because I'd gone TOU-D-A before solar by a year or so and got booted (Dec '21) at 5 years based on that. I'm going to guarantee there's going to be a lot of PO'd NEM 2.0 folks (the ones who first went TOU when they installed solar) when they start getting the letters. BTW...I chose 5-8 pm and will do everything in my power to not use power during those times. Already have freezer on timer...thinking about hacking my kitchen fridge so compressor on timer (not lights, as wife-e would revolt!). Short of that I'm going to try running fridge temp down from 4-5 pm and then raise back up at 5pm in an attempt for the compressor not to come on from 5-8 pm. Also, when it becomes AC season will do similar with AC and see if we can ride out two hours w/out AC (should have enough solar generation until Aug 1 or so to fire up AC window units).

On another suck-e note...I just looked at my last bill and with the "baseline credit" if one produces more than consumes, we get a "credit" of 8 cents/kwh...an actual charge!! Thus, POCO gets to skim off my NEM rates by that much. It seems the word "credit" would mean just that and not a negative credit. As I pointed out on another thread in order to "break even" with the new peak times (TOU) one needs to generate 40% more power (or consume less, or combination of two). This finding of the baseline credit charge was new to me as my typical bill in the past would be ~70-85% of consumption (seasonally dependent)...so would always get a (small) credit.

[Ward L]

SCE user with panels installed in 2014. I was on a tiered rate until this forum convinced me I should sign up for TOU D-A. The TOU first appeared to a gold mine as my accumulated energy charge was over $1,000 at the end of the relevant period (each May when SCE and I settle up). When we settled up, Edison paid the 3-4 cents/kWh and I made about the same money as if I had stayed on my tiered tariff. When SCE told me to choose a new tariff, the tiered tariff was the best deal. Tiered is the same as Domestic and the lowest cost plan in the examples above. I'm on Domestic (or tiered) rates and seem to be close to be where I was before, with TOU or my original tiered rate. Edison makes this so complicated it is pretty hard to predict. I track everything in Excel and I could be paying a little more with the new tiered rate when we settle up in May. I have an oversized system (the biggest system SCE would let me install). I have already recovered my solar installation costs. The bottom line suggestion is to sign up for the lowest cost plan SCE offers based on their calculations. The SCE has a rate calculator when you look at your online account. Sadly, SCE's first recommendation to me was NOT the lowest cost offer their calculator produced. For now, the California Public Utilities Commission did not vote to change the way the POCOs could screw domestic solar power. I just looked again at the SCE calculator and it still shows my lowest cost rate is the tiered plan at $209/year. The least expensive TOU is 4-9 at $439/year. The way my spreadsheet is projecting for May, I do not expect my bill to be as high as SCE is suggesting. We will see in May!

[oldguy]

SCE will always obfuscate with their predictions. For instance, when I went TOU 5 years ago (before solar install) they "ran my numbers" and told me it wasn't to my advantage. Of course that was prior to any behavior changes on my part...most notably the time I set to run my pool pump. Duh. During that time I went from $250/month to $80/month (full advantage of TOU and LED whole house replacement).

As for this current situation (note I'm NEM 2.0 but jacked by a year due to the "when I went on TOU" loophole) now my only choice is 5-8 or 4-9 peak hours. So trying to come up with the 40% needed of reduced consumption or increased production to break even. Note prior to switch in Dec 2021 I was essentially "even keel" on my bill at true up. Because I'd run 4 years that way I really hadn't done much else but recently I've gotten my kill-a-watt meter out again and found a few items. Notably was my silly big screen LCD tv which I had on the highest (menu) energy savings. Somehow it was still pulling 20 W when not on! How can that even be with energy star, etc?! What happens when you assume. That's 0.5 kwh/day. Also hadn't used my powered subwofer in a couple of years (on my to do list to get my surround sound back up!) and yet the little red led was lit, as in I left it on! 13 W. Finally, looked at my PC in hibernate state and found a big enough draw to just turn on/off and use less as I can do most of what I do on my PC with my phone/kindle. Also, because the 5-8 pm rate is punitive (I think $0.61/kwh) I've taken to switching off my fridge (through the internal rotary knob) at 5 pm and turning back on at 8 pm (use my phone alarm and kitchen timer for belt/suspender approach). Would use a timer except my fridge lights would be out and my wife would most likely leave me! My current consumption (assumes no heating or AC on any given day) now around 8 kWh vs 10 kWh. Producing now 20 kWh (early March) on a blue sky day. Trying to build up "the kitty" anticipating window AC usage this summer. We shall see. BTW, my Mid-Jan to Mid-Feb bill I produced a net of +43 kWh and yet had $10 of energy charges (against the true up) plus the $12 minimum charges. Pretty sure if last year (before TOU peak change) I would have had at least a $20 credit against the true up. Life goes on...