X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Am I being ripped off?

    I installed panels last year and I started heating and cooling my house strictly with electricity. The only things I used oil for was my hot water. I just calculated I spent between $1500 and $1700 for a years worth of hot water. I have a new high efficiency oil burner and an old water tank.

    it just seems like a hell of a lot.

    Im actually removing it and putting in an electric heat pump water heater this week but I’m really shocked by the charges over the last year.

    There are only two of us in the house although we admittedly like 10 minute showers. Probably 12 -15 a week I would say on average.

    So was I being ripped off?

  • #2
    Originally posted by Cshama View Post
    I installed panels last year and I started heating and cooling my house strictly with electricity. The only things I used oil for was my hot water. I just calculated I spent between $1500 and $1700 for a years worth of hot water. I have a new high efficiency oil burner and an old water tank.

    it just seems like a hell of a lot.

    Im actually removing it and putting in an electric heat pump water heater this week but I’m really shocked by the charges over the last year.

    There are only two of us in the house although we admittedly like 10 minute showers. Probably 12 -15 a week I would say on average.

    So was I being ripped off?
    If you are using heating oil you may be paying a lot for it. The price of fuel keeps going up and will as long as the demand is high or the source is limited or if there is pressure from the political arena to stop using fossil fuels. It is hard to say if you are being ripped off because fuel prices are not constant and will fluctuate for all kinds of reasons.

    You can try to go completely electric for your loads but remember the cost of electricity and batteries may make it as expensive or more then using fuel oil sometime in the near future. But for now it looks like fossil fuels are more expensive then electric. The probability of it changing is very high.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Cshama View Post
      I installed panels last year and I started heating and
      cooling my house strictly with electricity. The only things I used oil for was my hot
      water. I just calculated I spent between $1500 and $1700 for a years worth of hot
      water. I have a new high efficiency oil burner and an old water tank.
      it just seems like a hell of a lot.
      Im actually removing it and putting in an electric heat pump water heater this week but
      I’m really shocked by the charges over the last year.
      When I installed solar, it was based on the idea of direct energy comparisons between
      KWH and fossil fuels. At the time it looked like my science project might not break
      even. But with the total loss of energy price stability, solar looks way better. With
      my latest high tech Heat Pumps eliminating fossil fuel use, it looks like I will soon be
      solidly in the black. Keep us informed how your energy picture progresses as you
      make upgrades. Bruce Roe

      Comment


      • #4
        It's always possible you're being ripped off by your oil supplier, but I suspect the culprit(s) is/are closer to home.

        1.) How much are you paying for the oil per gallon ? How much has that price increased in the last year ? 2 years ?

        2.) How much water are you heating ? Have those patterns changed ?

        3.) Do you have a constant hot water circulator of the type that ensures instant hot water at the taps ? Those things are energy hogs. Getting rid of then usually knocks energy usage for DHW in half.

        Oil prices have gone up. To get a fix on the problem of why the price of providing hot water has increased (as it seems it has), it's necessary to begin by finding out how much fuel is being delivered and used, not necessarily what you pay for it, at least in the first analysis.

        If year/year usage (oil deliveries) has changed substantially but your day/day household usage of hot water has not (as a 1st estimate based on daily patterns of usage), the cause may be in the equipment or an unlikely, or at least (probably) easy to find leak.

        If oil usage/deliveries have not changed substantially, my money is on prices increases of oil to explain most of the increase in the annual bill.

        I'd start there for a SWAG on the annual bill increase.

        After that, or sooner, and in any case, I'd get an energy audit. Right now, you're shooting in the dark and without having some information that usually requires a site visit it's hard to analyze a situation. An audit may well reveal shortcomings caused by equipment failure/aging.

        FWIW, with 2 folks in my house, I've got an annual DHW load of ~ 9 million BTU. including standby/piping losses. If I used oil burning at, say, 70 % efficiency to supply that load, I'd need about 100 U.S. gal. of oil/yr.

        Annual DHW loads were similar when I lived in Buffalo where the DHW load was supplied by nat. gas and required about 12,000 - 13,000 ft.^3/yr. of nat. gas.
        Last edited by J.P.M.; 12-31-2021, 07:55 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Cshama View Post

          There are only two of us in the house although we admittedly like 10 minute showers. Probably 12 -15 a week I would say on average.

          So was I being ripped off?
          Can't tell if you are getting ripped off or not but you are paying for your lifestyle choices ->12-15 10min showers per week for two people. A simple change to showering every two days and/or shortening the time spent in the shower could have a decent positive effect on your hot water heating cost.

          Comment


          • #6
            Luckily I just bought a new electric heat pump water heater. With rebates it costs $2500 installed and will run off my solar panels like everything else in my house. We have full net metering in New York so it’s very cost effective.

            I just thought a $1700 oil bill for one year was insane. Personally, looking at the fill up intervals I think I was being ripped off because only this year did I stop heating my house with oil and in the Cold weather my fill ups became much more frequent - they obviously didn’t know I had new electric heat pumps installed.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Cshama View Post
              Luckily I just bought a new electric heat pump water heater. With rebates it costs $2500 installed and will run off my solar panels like everything else in my house. We have full net metering in New York so it’s very cost effective.
              We have had a hybrid tank a few months. It is using under 2KW a day, so our annual water heating bill is under $100. Only cost me $1,100 after the rebate and I installed it myself.

              BTW - we live in Florida so a couple of showers a day per person is not unusual.
              Last edited by mjs020294; 12-31-2021, 10:43 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Cshama View Post
                I just thought a $1700 oil bill for one year was insane. Personally, looking at the fill up intervals I think I was being ripped off because only this year did I stop heating my house with oil and in the Cold weather my fill ups became much more frequent - they obviously didn’t know I had new electric heat pumps installed.
                I told my propane (backup energy source) service I would call in refills. That only happens
                about August when the price is at minimum, it can rise much in winter. Bruce Roe

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hot water heaters can on occasion turn into house heaters if the piping is not designed to prevent thermo syphoning. Some homes are built with water recirculation systems to make the hot water out of faucet is instantly hot. How they do it is constantly recirculate heat back to the hot water tank effectively turning the hot water system into a hydronic loop. If the hot water is heated with an oil fired furnace, the boiler is kept warm all the time no matter how much water you use. And of course if you have slow water leak on the hot water system it would really chew up the oil but unless yoir water is not metered you would see a corresponding increase in water usuage.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Two of us in the house with a propane water heater and we spent about $1,500/yr for propane. I replaced the propane WH with an electric heat pump and the propane bill dropped to $500/year, a $1,000/yr savings. I have solar and can't really tell you how much more electricity the electric heat pump WH uses, but I'm sure it is a LOT less than $1,000/yr since I can't even see a difference in my electric bill. I've always thought heating oil was a very expensive way to heat your house or water. Even propane is 3x more expensive than natural gas. I don't think you were getting ripped off. You now have a much more efficient hot water system.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Ward L View Post
                      Two of us in the house with a propane water heater and we spent about $1,500/yr for propane. I replaced the propane WH with an electric heat pump and the propane bill dropped to $500/year, a $1,000/yr savings. I have solar and can't really tell you how much more electricity the electric heat pump WH uses, but I'm sure it is a LOT less than $1,000/yr since I can't even see a difference in my electric bill. I've always thought heating oil was a very expensive way to heat your house or water. Even propane is 3x more expensive than natural gas. I don't think you were getting ripped off. You now have a much more efficient hot water system.

                      Doesn't your heat pump water heater have wifi and an app? We can see what ours is using to the 0.01KW every day/week/month/year.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        It does not have WIFI. It mentioned an add on WIFI module in the literature but wasn't available at the time. It is an AO Smith.

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X