SCE NEM version if adding capacity?

[insaneoctane]

I'm currently on NEM 1.0 with 6kW system on SCE. Using TOU-D-A, which I think is closed (peak 10am to 8pm). I'm considering adding a new 4kW to help with the spa and EV that arrived after sizing my initial system. Exactly what would change for me wet NEM and plans?

[khanh dam]

what is nem 1.0 what is sce? I dont' have a masters in abbreviations! lol.

[J.P.M.]

what is nem 1.0 what is sce? I dont' have a masters in abbreviations! lol.

1.) NEM 1.0 is what preceded NEM 2.0.
2.) SCE== Southern California Edison.

Google is your friend.

[SunEagle]

1.) NEM 1.0 is what preceded NEM 2.0.
2.) SCE== Southern California Edison.

Google is your friend.

So for us non CA residents, NEM is an electric rate plan

[J.P.M.]

So for us non CA residents, NEM is an electric rate plan

NEM == Net Energy Metering.
See what are probably several thousand posts on this forum over the years that mention, reference and discuss the term NEM for particulars.

[Ampster]

I'm currently on NEM 1.0 with 6kW system on SCE......... I'm considering adding a new 4kW to help with the spa and EV that arrived after sizing my initial system. Exactly what would change for me wet NEM and plans?

What would change is you would most likely be forced onto NEM 2.0. That would mean that all your export to the grid would be charged a Non Bypassable Charge. Typically that is about $0.025 per kWh. Another issue is that your rate plan (TOU-D-A) may lose its grandfathering.
You would have to do some research on the SCE site to check these assumptions. I say, MAY, because I do not know the details of the grandfathering, of that rate plan. The hours of your current tariff are more favorable to solar but you would have to do the math comparing the new tariffs and schedules to your existing plan, and your usage, and generation.

Adding an EV gives you access to EV rate plans that have much more favorable super off peak rates at the cost of higher peak rates. You may be able to set a timer on the Spa to use that lower rate for most of your Spa heating and filtering needs.
If the above are not too challeging to your spreadsheet skills here is an outside the box scenerio to add to the hypotheticals. It is possible to add Non Export solar with just a building permit. I know that SolarEdge, Enphase and some other inverters can be programmed for Non Export. Whether this is optimal would depend on your load profile and your ability to shift other loads. When doing this kind of analysis it is important to double check what people tell you against verifiable facts by reading your existing NEM agreement, the rate tariffs currently in effect and any tariffs soon to be implemented. I am sorry i cannot offer the specificity that you asked for but it is a question with circumstances unique to your situation and i don't have enouh details.

[khanh dam]

"1.) NEM 1.0 is what preceded NEM 2.0. wow, LOL, you truely have the gift of teaching! bless you and happy new year. It's like you would rather put somone down than just answer the question.

[khanh dam]

if you are already on netmetering, how the heck is the utility going to know you added more solar panels? For all they know you could just be using less electricity and thus exporting excess to the grid. serious question, not being flippant. get your permit, add the panels and don't tell them. why would you be obligated to tell them and why do they have the right to change your previous net metering agreement just because you add panels. Edited to add sunEagle get off your high horse. no one is cheating the poco because not all poco require you to sign some document limiting your solar array to only a certain size.
Most poco are monopolies that charge consumers for their dumb mistakes like coal ash cleanup, nuculear plants that were never built etc. put that in perspective. unbelievable how you attack over your assumptions.

[SunEagle]

if you are already on netmetering, how the heck is the utility going to know you added more solar panels? For all they know you could just be using less electricity and thus exporting excess to the grid. serious question, not being flippant. get your permit, add the panels and don't tell them. why would you be obligated to tell them and why do they have the right to change your previous net metering agreement just because you add panels.

We really don't condone people openly cheating the POCO. If you are under contract to have X amount of panel wattage you are obligated to contact your POCO if that should change.

So please be careful of what you post about adding solar generation without first contacting your POCO or I might have to delete your posts.

[khanh dam]

You are assuming all POCO's have contracts that agree with your assumptions. do you really think your assumptions are universally accepted world wide by all poco? I think I would not bet on that.

And why would you threated to delete my posts when I say up front I am seriously wondering and not being flippant?

happy new year.

[J.P.M.]

"1.) NEM 1.0 is what preceded NEM 2.0. wow, LOL, you truely have the gift of teaching! bless you and happy new year. It's like you would rather put somone down than just answer the question.

That NEM 1.0 is what preceded NEM 2.0 is a true statement, not a put down. just attempting a teaching moment. Sorry you didn't get it.
Anyway, I've never claimed to be a teacher, but I do seem to recall my best teachers helped, encouraged and pointed me in directions that enabled me to find my own answers, especially for the obvious stuff.
Besides, enabling behavior is not one of my strong points.
Q: Have you always felt so entitled as to expect to be spoon fed info on demand you can just as well find on your own by doing 30 seconds worth of work ? I've been called a mother, but I'm not yours and she doesn't work here.

[SunEagle]

You are assuming all POCO's have contracts that agree with your assumptions. do you really think your assumptions are universally accepted world wide by all poco? I think I would not bet on that.

And why would you threated to delete my posts when I say up front I am seriously wondering and not being flippant?

happy new year.

You may be correct that world wide every POCO does not have an agreement with their customers but I have to keep people from thinking that cheating their POCO is acceptable.

Anyone that posts that it is ok to do so is not going to continue to post in this forum.

And I will have a Happy new year as long as I can help people to be safe and not doing anything illegal.

[Ampster]

if you are already on netmetering, how the heck is the utility going to know you added more solar panels? For all they know you could just be using less electricity and thus exporting excess to the grid. serious question, not being flippant. get your permit, add the panels and don't tell them. why would you be obligated to tell them and why do they have the right to change your previous net metering agreement just because you add panels.

In addition to what @SunEagle posted, in California, NEM takes the form of a contract between the consumer and the utility. The only workaround is the grey area of adding capacity which is Non Export. As I mentioned that may take only a building permit for certain areas where Investor Owned Utilities operate. Municipal Utilities may be able to legislate more stringent requirements because those cities also control the building codes.

[SunEagle]

NEM == Net Energy Metering.
See what are probably several thousand posts on this forum over the years that mention, reference and discuss the term NEM for particulars.

Good point. I have been accused of having a short memory.

[J.P.M.]

if you are already on netmetering, how the heck is the utility going to know you added more solar panels? For all they know you could just be using less electricity and thus exporting excess to the grid. serious question, not being flippant. get your permit, add the panels and don't tell them. why would you be obligated to tell them and why do they have the right to change your previous net metering agreement just because you add panels.

They will know, or at least they can determine when your delivery and draw patterns vary from historical patterns. Also, they have something analogous to the sword of Damocles hanging over the head of the NEM with a customer if a residential user gets caught willfully violating the agreement that was signed. Basically they can terminate the agreement because the terms were violated Will they catch you ? if so, will they terminate the NEM ? Maybe not, but seeing as how they're the most powerful utility around, you got to ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky" ?
Then too, there's the minor issue of being a stand up guy and sticking with the agreement you signed with the POwer COmpany (the "POCO") if for no other reasons than your own self respect and integrity by telling SCE about your intentions as part of what you signed.

NOMB, but you seem pretty eager to offer advice about what to do with an NEM when an hour or so ago you didn't even know what NEM meant.

Insaneoctane: I respectfully suggest you consider reading up on NEM 1.0 and NEM 2.0. Then I'd just as respectfully suggest you consider calling SCE and telling them of your intentions before you act. Under your current NEM 1.0 agreement, you can increase an array size by 1 STC kW or 10% of the array size (whichever is greater) without hassle and stay on NEM 1.0. I'm also pretty sure you can also increase beyond that, but notification is necessary, and I'm pretty sure the bigger (4 STC kW) change will, or at least can, knock you out of NEM 1.0 and into NEM 2.0. That means T.O.U. if you're not already on T.O.U (There are no tiered rates in NEM 2.0) and the end of some of the NEM bennies that NEM 2.0 does not have.
Not notifying SCE and trying to skunk it through and you may get away with it for a while - maybe a long while - but if you're discovered the consequences can be pretty ugly and draconian, including termination of the NEM you have and other ugly stuff. Given that POCO's aren't crazy about net metering to begin with, I'd consider my options carefully.