Best Practice for roof work in prep for solar?

[so_cal_burbs]

Getting solar quotes for my southeast facing roof in San Diego. I have been working with recommended vendors and getting great pricing on the solar arrays using strategies gleaned from this board of reduction, education and requesting apples to apples quotes. But JPM's frequent refrain of getting the roof inspected is just now filtering onto my ToDo list. I started by speaking with a friend of mine that builds home tracts about my house hoping he would tell me not to worry-but that isn't what happened.

My home is a tract built home that is 20 years old and has concrete roof tiles. It turns out that the tiles are only part of the system, and the underlayment is what actually keeps things water tight (I realize many of you here already know this). This underlayment is the black, tar paper (or synthetic) that you see over the plywood when homes are being built. Most homes like mine use as flimsy a paper as they can get away with. My friend told me to expect about 30 years, my internet research upon getting home says 20-30 is typical. So definitely need to get new underlayment as part of the project unless my shingles turn out to be the magical interlocking style which supposedly are water tight on their own. should I start over with vendors?

I searched this forum this morning and found lots of people using separate companies for the roof and the solar. I understand the theory of using 'best in class' vendors for each separate item-but it seems to me to be likely that any water leakage problems down the road will be a nightmare of finger pointing between the two. I expected the forum to recommend using a company that does both and dreading the lack of competition and likely higher quotes I would be finding.

I've reached out to a couple of my vendors asking how they handle such situations-but am leery of them subcontracting out to a low bidder and gambling whether they will ever have to come deal with leaks. While I wait to hear back I'm looking for advice on how prior forum members handled this and how it worked out.

[littleharbor]

Is your proposed array going to be a straightforward bank of panels? Is the Southeastern exposure relatively free of obstacles? It would behoove you, especially on a straightforward, clear roof to at least remove the tiles that will be under the array and re waterproof there. Replacing the tiles on this type of roof situation is a fairly simple job.Some folks will leave the tiles off in this area and put up the array right over the waterproofed surface. That would be your choice and may depend how this aesthetically works for you. How visible will it be? Otherwise have the solar contractor at least confer with the roofing contractor as to the placement of the standoffs and flashings.

[so_cal_burbs]

Array is a straight forward bank of panels with without trees or shade. There are some soffits and vents that I assume they will work around. The roof is literally invisible from my property because the two story house is back far enough in the lot that it cannot be seen so I won't be asking for any additional work for aesthetics. I've seen the debate in several threads about leaving off tiles under the panels and replacing with composite and although I believe that can be done successfully I'd prefer to leave the existing tiles in place and just replace the underlayment.

[inspron]

Just my personal opinion here. You should *NOT* have 2 vendors working on your roof within a short window of time. *IF* later there is a leak, one will point the finger at the other and it will be a nightmare to deal with 3-way blame game with plausible deniability from all parties.

Get a competent installer and let them deal with everything from A to Z. if there is a leak, you can hold them wholly responsible. Also, it might be more financially beneficial to include some of the roof prep work part of the "solar installation costs" - since you'll get a tax credit for those amounts. My concrete tile roof is approximately 15 years old and the installer had no issue.

If you want to get more detailed info, contact me privately and I share with your my installation experience.

[so_cal_burbs]

inspron I can't find a way to send a private message on this board. Perhaps I don't have a post count high enough to be allowed to. If you can PM me I'd be happy to get more detailed info on what you went through in your install.

[sensij]

Just my personal opinion here. You should *NOT* have 2 vendors working on your roof within a short window of time. *IF* later there is a leak, one will point the finger at the other and it will be a nightmare to deal with 3-way blame game with plausible deniability from all parties.

Get a competent installer and let them deal with everything from A to Z. if there is a leak, you can hold them wholly responsible. Also, it might be more financially beneficial to include some of the roof prep work part of the "solar installation costs" - since you'll get a tax credit for those amounts. My concrete tile roof is approximately 15 years old and the installer had no issue.

If you want to get more detailed info, contact me privately and I share with your my installation experience.

There is no PM system here. Please feel free to post your experiences publicly, there are many San Diego area forum members and it helps us stay up to date with current prices and practices.

[DrLumen]

I had different vendors for the roof and solar. I had some months between the re-roof and the solar install so I was able to confirm the lack of leaks before the solar went up.

[inspron]

inspron I can't find a way to send a private message on this board. Perhaps I don't have a post count high enough to be allowed to. If you can PM me I'd be happy to get more detailed info on what you went through in your install.

Contact Matt, the owner, at Sunline 858-252-2280 and ask for a quote. They did a good job at my site.

I was going to privately share with you my site pictures but since PM is not available, I don't feel comfortable posting my house on a public forum. If you contact Sunline, they can share with you my site details for reference. I'm "Key" and my house is in Mira Mesa.

[inspron]

I had different vendors for the roof and solar. I had some months between the re-roof and the solar install so I was able to confirm the lack of leaks before the solar went up.

Hypothetical question, how would a leak in 2 years be handled? My fear is one vendor will blame the other for the leak. Difficult and expensive "prove" the responsible party.

[J.P.M.]

DO NOT leave the tiles out from under array. It is of no benefit to you to do that. Try to think of one way that roof integrity against leaks will be better. I've tried and I sure can't. I can think of a bunch of reasons not to do change roof materials under an array, both short and long term, starting with the transitions near the bottom (lower) part of the array where you'll need some way to get a comp. shingle OVER a tile and keep it there while not allowing a sump for standing water. If that isn't done or if it's not good for 20+ years, ou're building in a problem that doesn't need to exist for no reason that makes any sense. You won't even be able to inspect it, or anything else under the array properly. Show me how that's better.

The only party benefiting by not keeping all the tile or other original roofing system under an array will be those who will save time and $$ not reinstalling the tile and/or installers not needing to spend the extra time being careful not to break tiles. What are you paying for ?

Not keeping the same roofing system in place is of no benefit to the homeowner and on the contrary, opens up a lot of possibilities for future problems that will belong to the owner long after the installers have gone.

It's a B.S. rip off technique.

[J.P.M.]

Array is a straight forward bank of panels with without trees or shade. There are some soffits and vents that I assume they will work around. The roof is literally invisible from my property because the two story house is back far enough in the lot that it cannot be seen so I won't be asking for any additional work for aesthetics. I've seen the debate in several threads about leaving off tiles under the panels and replacing with composite and although I believe that can be done successfully I'd prefer to leave the existing tiles in place and just replace the underlayment.

Regqardless of how it's done or the method(s) used, It'll be done successfully until it leaks or other problems occur. Provided it's done competently and professionally, replacing the paper and putting the tiles back in place will have a higher probability of lasting a long time than the blow & go barn job of replacing tile with comp. shingles.

As for 2 different vendors, one for the roof repair, one for the PV, pros and cons. The finger pointing possibility is a valid consideration. On the other hand, large projects have many vendors with overlapping scopes of supply and responsibility. If their scopes of work and responsibility are defined in a way all understand and it's all written down and signed off, things can go smoothly.

I had separate solar and roofing vendors. Each new their scope of supply and work, both knew what the job entailed and I was project mgr. Coordination, scheduling and communication are the keys. My roofing vendor had done sub work for solar vendors prior to my job, but not with my vendor. Both knew what was required and when. Both knew scope and schedule. I ran the project like it was a job.

[DrLumen]

Hypothetical question, how would a leak in 2 years be handled? My fear is one vendor will blame the other for the leak. Difficult and expensive "prove" the responsible party.

Personally, I would investigate the issue by getting in the attic and see where the water appears to be entering and then hold whatever installer responsible. With asphalt shingles, unlike some other roofing surfaces, it is not hard to find where the water is entering. I don't play the blame game as I am the judge. Worst, worst case would be to get a 3rd party opinion and then hold whatever party responsible for the repair of the leak(s) and any 3rd party opinion fees. I'm not lawsuit happy but that is the reason behind small claims court.

As a side note to the OP. If there is any doubt by the solar installer on how to deal with a particular roof system, have them and the roofers get together on a solution. They will work out a solution before hand and there won't be as much finger pointing if a problem does arise. I would suggest putting their agreement in writing and have them both sign off on it.

[so_cal_burbs]

Small company offered to repaper just under the array for $750. Large company offered to repaper the whole slope the panels will sit on (1000sq feet) for $6k. Both of these are solar companies with dedicated, in house roofers FWIW. I'd prefer the whole slope be done but am concerned that small company won't be around if problems down the road. I'm getting more quotes but wanted to check here does that sound in the right ball park for two layer 30# underlayment rip and replace under a cement tile roof?

[Edit to add the small company quote is for 25 LG 335W panels which some back of the envelope calculations is about 460 Square feet just in panels]

[solarix]

My experience is the solar company will generally be the one blamed for any leaks that occur under or in the vicinity of the array ("It didn't leak before the solar was installed"). My insurance company (even though I'm the one paying them) rolls over on any leak claims and assumes its my fault as it is too hard to establish cause in these situations. They just want to pay to get the damage fixed (not the leak fixed) and have the homeowner sign a waiver so that if (more like when) the roofs leaks again - they have no further claim. To avoid pissed customers, I have to pay to get a roofer involved and solve the leak problem and so far have been blessed to have it not be our fault.

[inspron]

Small company offered to repaper just under the array for $750. Large company offered to repaper the whole slope the panels will sit on (1000sq feet) for $6k. Both of these are solar companies with dedicated, in house roofers FWIW. I'd prefer the whole slope be done but am concerned that small company won't be around if problems down the road. I'm getting more quotes but wanted to check here does that sound in the right ball park for two layer 30# underlayment rip and replace under a cement tile roof?

[Edit to add the small company quote is for 25 LG 335W panels which some back of the envelope calculations is about 460 Square feet just in panels]

$750 does sound too cheap.