Sanity Checking + Advice on SolarEdge

[ButchDeal]

1 big decision is SE or String. SE will cost me about $4000~ where as KACO Transformerless String Inverters 2x 5.0 KW will cost me $1400 for 2. I will have a total of 4 MPPTs. Web connected , monitoring, self consumption and all.

You would have added costs with two string inverters over a single SolarEdge inverter.
You would need a fused disconnect to combine them and provide the two with a single disconnect, vs just a disconnect for a larger SolarEdge inverter.

If you have to provide any rapid shutdown capabilities solaredge is going to be quite a bit cheaper than third party rapid shut down for 4 strings.

[Magius]

String inverters are a very attractive option for many installs. If you don't have problems that require something fancier, certainly consider string. The friend I mentioned in my previous post could (should?) have gone string inverter, since he only has two array directions on his roof, South and East, neither with any shading problems. He's a data nerd / computer engineer like me though, so he spent the money for the per panel monitoring. He also knew the installer personally and got a great price so it was less of a delta.

On my roof I had little choice. Even though there is no shading, I put panels on seven roof faces, and of those only two have the exact same pitch and azimuth. I'm sure panels with a minor difference in pitch (2/12) wouldn't have been a big problem sharing a string, but with the three azimuths I didn't feel like a string inverter was the way to go to optimize my power output. I also went with high efficiency 320W panels since I was maxing out all of my roof real-estate, and I didn't want to take a chance clipping 270W Enphase inverters. So that make my decision to go SE much easier, and having seen the performance for about a month and a half now I have no regrets.

[aleenoor]

Hi ButchDeal and Sensij,
i am not sure if I am under NEC 2014 or 2014 however, my understanding is the KACO has a DC disconnect, AFCI and all. I was looking at these here:

https://www.civicsolar.com/product/kaco-blueplanet-5kw-inverter-bp-20-tl1-m2-wm-od-us39-afci-and-comcard

If I use 2 inverters, does in mean that I will have to have a separate DC disconnect ?

Even if I go with SE, I would like to go with the 2x HD wave 5K or 6K which should be available in a couple of weeks.

[aleenoor]

String inverters are a very attractive option for many installs. If you don't have problems that require something fancier, certainly consider string. The friend I mentioned in my previous post could (should?) have gone string inverter, since he only has two array directions on his roof, South and East, neither with any shading problems. He's a data nerd / computer engineer like me though, so he spent the money for the per panel monitoring. He also knew the installer personally and got a great price so it was less of a delta.

On my roof I had little choice. Even though there is no shading, I put panels on seven roof faces, and of those only two have the exact same pitch and azimuth. I'm sure panels with a minor difference in pitch (2/12) wouldn't have been a big problem sharing a string, but with the three azimuths I didn't feel like a string inverter was the way to go to optimize my power output. I also went with high efficiency 320W panels since I was maxing out all of my roof real-estate, and I didn't want to take a chance clipping 270W Enphase inverters. So that make my decision to go SE much easier, and having seen the performance for about a month and a half now I have no regrets.

Marc,
Yes, If I were you I would have done exactly the same. Do you by any chance know if we hare under NEC 2011 or NEC 2014 code ?

Thanks,

[ButchDeal]

Hi ButchDeal and Sensij,
i am not sure if I am under NEC 2014 or 2014 however, my understanding is the KACO has a DC disconnect, AFCI and all. I was looking at these here:

https://www.civicsolar.com/product/kaco-blueplanet-5kw-inverter-bp-20-tl1-m2-wm-od-us39-afci-and-comcard

If I use 2 inverters, does in mean that I will have to have a separate DC disconnect ?

Even if I go with SE, I would like to go with the 2x HD wave 5K or 6K which should be available in a couple of weeks.

With two inverters you will need an AC combiner usually done as a combiner/disconnect. This is very different from the DC disconnect.

The SE5000H and SE6000H are not yet available but even so why not go with the SE7600H or SE10000A. Two inverters is just adding complexity and cost to the install.

[sensij]

Marc,
Yes, If I were you I would have done exactly the same. Do you by any chance know if we hare under NEC 2011 or NEC 2014 code ?

Thanks,

Florida is 2011 NEC until 12/31/17, at least according to this. It would be worth double-checking with your local AHJ.

[Magius]

Marc, Do you by any chance know if we hare under NEC 2011 or NEC 2014 code ?

I was given a copy of my engineering three-line drawings, and the drawing notes call out "All work to be done in accordance with the National Electric Code 2011 and any local AHJ or utility requirements". I don't know what AHJ is, but it sounds like unless Duke requires you to use NEC 2014, then you should be OK with NEC 2011. If you contacted a solar installer they'd be able to tell you for sure what the codes are in your area. Mine seemed very knowledgeable about the differences in what's allowed between OUC, FPL, etc.

[aleenoor]

With two inverters you will need an AC combiner usually done as a combiner/disconnect. This is very different from the DC disconnect.

The SE5000H and SE6000H are not yet available but even so why not go with the SE7600H or SE10000A. Two inverters is just adding complexity and cost to the install.

I was told 50000H and 6000H will be available early in Q2 and cheaper than non HD models. Not to mention 99.2% weighted efficiency vs 97.5% for current models.

Additionally, not sure if SE-7600H / 10000H is going to be available any time soon. Also 7600H should be be clipping a clipping on 11.8kW DC array facing south at 26 degree tilt.

I see I have to have a DC disconnect within 10 ft from the array. How much do these things cost roughly. (and I thought I have done all my research)

[aleenoor]

I was given a copy of my engineering three-line drawings, and the drawing notes call out "All work to be done in accordance with the National Electric Code 2011 and any local AHJ or utility requirements". I don't know what AHJ is, but it sounds like unless Duke requires you to use NEC 2014, then you should be OK with NEC 2011. If you contacted a solar installer they'd be able to tell you for sure what the codes are in your area. Mine seemed very knowledgeable about the differences in what's allowed between OUC, FPL, etc.

Thanks Marc,
IIRC, AHJ = Authority having Jurisdiction. Pretty much Orange county building inspector in my case (and your case too in you are in Lake Nona). Also, can you share contacts of some good / friendly installers that you interacted with.
I wonder who will be willing to work with me if I source my own equipment.

[ButchDeal]

Additionally, not sure if SE-7600H / 10000H is going to be available any time soon. Also 7600H should be be clipping a clipping on 11.8kW DC array facing south at 26 degree tilt.

The SE10000A is currently available. You mentioned 4 MPPTs with the other option so I though the array was on multiple faces. I would not do an all single face, this large on an SE7600H.

I see I have to have a DC disconnect within 10 ft from the array. How much do these things cost roughly. (and I thought I have done all my research)

You would need 4 disconnects (8 really for both positive and negative) for the two dual MPPT string inverters. They likely have to be automated as well (costly).

You would not need them at all for any SolarEdge solution.

[sensij]

Hi ButchDeal and Sensij,
i am not sure if I am under NEC 2014 or 2014 however, my understanding is the KACO has a DC disconnect, AFCI and all. I was looking at these here:

https://www.civicsolar.com/product/k...ci-and-comcard

If I use 2 inverters, does in mean that I will have to have a separate DC disconnect ?

Even if I go with SE, I would like to go with the 2x HD wave 5K or 6K which should be available in a couple of weeks.

Dang, that is half the price of any comparable inverter. Made in the USA, according to this. Rapid shutdown would add another $500 to my system cost, making the total for the inverter $1250, about $1000 less than Solaredge for the same system. Since 5 kW is the largest they make, the system would be smaller (6160 W vs 7840 W), but it knocks the price per watt down from ~1.30 to about ~1.10. I don't think I'll change course now, but maybe would have if I saw this a month ago.

[sensij]

I see I have to have a DC disconnect within 10 ft from the array. How much do these things cost roughly. (and I thought I have done all my research)

This is normally a 2014 NEC requirement, not 2011. Where are you seeing the need for it?

[Magius]

I can't for the life of me figure out how to send you a PM, and I can't remember if recommending solar installers in the threads is in line with the forum rules or not, lol. Let me know and I'd be happy to let you know who I used. I highly recommend them.

That said, it's hard to say whether any given installer would be willing to work with you if you provide all the equipment. These guys make most of their money on marking up the equipment, not on a couple days worth of labor, so you might be surprised what kind of installation quote you get if they're even willing to install hardware you provide yourself. Said a different way, with made up numbers, if they can make a 50% profit from some "regular" customer down the street, why would they take your job where they'd make nothing on parts and only 20% profit on labor? Both jobs keep one or more of their limited install crews busy for a couple days, so it's an opportunity cost for them. That said, you'll never know if you don't ask!

[J.P.M.]

I can't for the life of me figure out how to send you a PM, and I can't remember if recommending solar installers in the threads is in line with the forum rules or not, lol. Let me know and I'd be happy to let you know who I used. I highly recommend them.

That said, it's hard to say whether any given installer would be willing to work with you if you provide all the equipment. These guys make most of their money on marking up the equipment, not on a couple days worth of labor, so you might be surprised what kind of installation quote you get if they're even willing to install hardware you provide yourself. Said a different way, with made up numbers, if they can make a 50% profit from some "regular" customer down the street, why would they take your job where they'd make nothing on parts and only 20% profit on labor? Both jobs keep one or more of their limited install crews busy for a couple days, so it's an opportunity cost for them. That said, you'll never know if you don't ask!

There are no PM's.

[aleenoor]

There are no PM's.

I thought I saw a setting under settings / profile to enable messages.