Please help determining actual solar costs (the cost of the company doing it)

[Behappy123]

I broke down the costs below (here in the mid-west), and I feel like I have covered pretty much all of it, however, a few electric companies I have talked to see to state their costs are almost a full dollar per watt higher(they are saying their costs are more like $2.60, which is a lot more than $1.60 I arrived to below), I am trying to find out what I'm missing, if you know, I appreciate your help!

Here's what I have:

(For a 10kw system)

-panels- ~50-85c a watt (Depending on type of panel) - $5000-8500
-inverters- ~30c a watt - $3000
-other equipment (balance of system) - Est no more than $1000 a system (wires, grounds, etc)
-site survey - ~$100
-cad design - $20 (2 hours of work, at $10/hr)
-permitting- ~$1000 or less
-administrative- cost of administrative employees to do background permitting, customer service, and related- ~$500 or less
-installation - ~$1000 (~$200 per installer per job)
-racking - ~$1000 or less
-misc avg per account- around $1000

Total: ~$1.60 per watt or roughly $16,000

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I know I didnt include overhead costs (like brick and mortar business), but I am looking for actual core costs of doing a solar system. If you can see I'm missing anything or off significantly on anything please let me know.
Thank you in advance for your help!

[solar pete]

Hi Behappy123 and welcome to Solar Panel Talk,

I think a bit more info might be required, like what type of install, type of roof or ground mount, brands of inverter are important to me so I'd want to know that. Do you have any shade issues? There will probably be some people from around your neck of the woods here to help out soon, good luck with it, read up, cheers

[Behappy123]

Hi Behappy123 and welcome to Solar Panel Talk,

I think a bit more info might be required, like what type of install, type of roof or ground mount, brands of inverter are important to me so I'd want to know that. Do you have any shade issues? There will probably be some people from around your neck of the woods here to help out soon, good luck with it, read up, cheers

Thanks for getting back to me so fast, it is for a house with

Shingle roof, no shade issues and a mid-range inverter I would say.

[foo1bar]

-panels- ~50-85c a watt (Depending on type of panel) - $5000-8500
* $.70-$1/watt is more likely. (depends on system)

-inverters- ~30c a watt - $3000
* Pair of 5kw inverters would be $4k
* single 10kw inverter might be $3k
* IF you have some shading, then $65 * 38 for optimizers + $1900 for inverter ($4370)

-other equipment (balance of system) - Est no more than $1000 a system (wires, grounds, etc)
* WAY low.
* I had 32 panels, and the BOS from the solar retailer was $2750 (rails, mounting feet, wire clips, etc)
* I spent over $1K at HD on wire, ground wire, roof sealant, conduit, circuit breaker, conduit fittings, screws, etc. etc.

-site survey - ~$100
-cad design - $20 (2 hours of work, at $10/hr)
* I'd guess somewhere around $300-$500 - possibly more because so many of those wouldn't result in sales and have to be accounted for.

-permitting- ~$1000 or less
* depends on where you are. Mine was $300 + 4 hours sitting at the city offices. (4 hours @ $50+ = $200+)

-administrative- cost of administrative employees to do background permitting, customer service, and related- ~$500 or less
* I'd consider that as separate from costs of the job... (ie. 40% for overhead)

-installation - ~$1000 (~$200 per installer per job)
* So you're guesstimating a crew of 5 doing it in 2 days?
* $100 would be $10/hour average for the crew. But at least one of those needs to be certified... Don't see how that could work.

-racking - ~$1000 or less
* Ah - I thought you had this with BoS - Well, still $2k for racking + BoS still isn't enough....

-misc avg per account- around $1000
* see above about how much I spent at HD. (I need to actually tally everything up sometime soon)

[pleppik]

-cad design - $20 (2 hours of work, at $10/hr)

-installation - ~$1000 (~$200 per installer per job)
* So you're guesstimating a crew of 5 doing it in 2 days?
* $100 would be $10/hour average for the crew. But at least one of those needs to be certified... Don't see how that could work.

I don't think there's any way you're going to get a CAD designer or a solar installer to work for anything close to $10/hour. That's barely above minimum wage (in some places it's below minimum wage), and these are jobs which require some skill and experience. Plus you have to gross it up to include taxes, insurance (workers' comp), tools and equipment, downtime, and other labor overhead. $35-$50/hour including overhead is probably more realistic, maybe more in some markets.

Also, don't forget that you'll need a licensed electrician somewhere in there, too. Those guys don't come cheap.

[Behappy123]

Thanks for the replies guys, but those costs are say perhaps 30c-40c more (or $3000, for a 10kw system).
That would bring the cost up to $1.90 - $2.00 or so, but is still a sizable gap between that and the $2.50 - $2.70 I was told from the solar companies I talked to, what else might it be?

@foo1bar Did I miss any system components / requirements for doing an install? or is that all of them?

[Samsolar]

Flashings for my system cost over $600 excluding shipping and that was 8.4kW, 46 mounts. Shipping was $500 just to get all materials to my house. Your racking number seems low by at least a few hundred.

For my install which was very plain, materials only came in at just under $2/watt for a micro inverter setup with LG panels. While you can save a bit off of that with a string setup, you still need to add in all engineering, permits, inspections, and labor to get it all done.

I think something in the range of $2/watt for materials and $1.25-$2.00/watt for everything else (includes overhead and profit) is more reasonable for a turnkey system. This obviously excludes things like roof work or electrical panel upgrades.

[Behappy123]

Flashings for my system cost over $600 excluding shipping and that was 8.4kW, 46 mounts. Shipping was $500 just to get all materials to my house. Your racking number seems low by at least a few hundred.

For my install which was very plain, materials only came in at just under $2/watt for a micro inverter setup with LG panels. While you can save a bit off of that with a string setup, you still need to add in all engineering, permits, inspections, and labor to get it all done.

I think something in the range of $2/watt for materials and $1.25-$2.00/watt for everything else (includes overhead and profit) is more reasonable for a turnkey system. This obviously excludes things like roof work or electrical panel upgrades.

Can you please break down how your materials came in the range of $2/watt?

[Samsolar]

Can you please break down how your materials came in the range of $2/watt?

Sure:

Panels $0.97
Shipping $0.058
Inverters (m250 + cable) $0.58
Racking w/ flashing $0.21
Misc: Production meter, meter socket, AC combiner panel, breakers, Enphase Envoy, 10/3 Romex, Surge protector, #6 ground wire, #8 wire, geocell 2300, Soladeck, terminal blocks, system labels, roofing nails, network cable, racking clips, zip ties, strain reliefs for Soladeck, $0.18

[sdold]

what else might it be?

Profit? SSI, Workman's comp, insurance, etc?

[s_man]

For a 10kW system with SolarEdge inverter and optimizer, from a paper I have seen
Electrical Balance of system: ~$1100
Everest & Quick mount PV & racking for comp. shingle roof: ~$2200
Tool Expense: $200
Vehicle Expense: $500
Labor Cost: $5500
Plan & permit: $1500
100% commission salesman: $2000 -$3000
= $13,000 -$14,000 ($1.3 -$1.4/watt)

then add cost of panel & inverter.
36(Solarword 280) x $300 = $10,800
1 SolarEdge 10000 = $2000
36 (P300) optimizer =$2,200
= $15,000 ($1.5/watt)

Total system cost = $29,000 ($2.9/watt)

Cheaper panel and inverter will reduce $/watt