PPA vs buying

[solar pete]

Hi Tml

Hi Solar Pete here,

Very interesting thread, my thoughts Tml were basically, from your original post I got the impression you were likely to stay in your current home for a quite along time you may have mentioned 20 years. If that's likely to be the case and you have now done the pool pump and reduced your usage as much as you can I think its a bit of a no brainer to either buy, lease or ppa a system, and thats the order that makes the most sense to me.

Some really good info has been supplied on this thread, my we have some talented people on this site. Cheers and it would be great if you could keep us posted, I really enjoyed reading this thread, thanks.

[nomadh]

Just wanted to add for historical record that I too had a ppa quote from both vivant and solar city. Very similar contracts both with the 2.9% escalation. Vivant "claims" they have not had an increase yet but don't know how I can prove that but I did like the quality of the system and they were offering enphase microinverters. Certainly a step up from a commodity system. Solar city said they will enforce the 2.9% escalation but offered a zero escalation for a sliding scale price of either some money down and or a price per kw start point increase. For example I could do 0 down but instead of $.15 /kwh it would be .19 but fixed for 20 years. Or I could put 7k down and fix it at 12.5 cents / kwh. Rough approximations we threw a lot of numbers around but you get the jist. I think i settled on $500 down and 16.5 cents for some sort of return rate of 2200% in funny money but it sure looked impressive. Vivant did say they expect to be able to also drop the escalator clause in the near future so keep checking.

[russ]

Very similar contracts both with the 2.9% escalation. Vivant "claims" they have not had an increase yet If the increase is allowed in the contract you can bet they will take advantage of it

I did like the quality of the system and they were offering enphase microinverters. Certainly a step up from a commodity system. I realize that is what the saelsman told you but it is so much BS

Solar city said they will enforce the 2.9% escalation but offered a zero escalation for a sliding scale price of either some money down and or a price per kw start point increase. For example I could do 0 down but instead of $.15 /kwh it would be .19 but fixed for 20 years. Or I could put 7k down and fix it at 12.5 cents / kwh. Rough approximations we threw a lot of numbers around but you get the jist. I think i settled on $500 down and 16.5 cents for some sort of return rate of 2200% in funny money but it sure looked impressive. Vivant did say they expect to be able to also drop the escalator clause in the near future so keep checking. These guys have done the math - if they offer something it is a winner for them.

Comments in bold within the text

[nomadh]

Originally Posted by nomadh View Post
Very similar contracts both with the 2.9% escalation.------------ Vivant "claims" they have not had an increase yet If the increase is allowed in the contract you can bet they will take advantage of it

I did like the quality of the system and they were offering enphase microinverters. Certainly a step up from a commodity system. ------- I realize that is what the saelsman told you but it is so much BS

Solar city said they will enforce the 2.9% escalation but offered a zero escalation for a sliding scale price of either some money down and or a price per kw start point increase. For example I could do 0 down but instead of $.15 /kwh it would be .19 but fixed for 20 years. Or I could put 7k down and fix it at 12.5 cents / kwh. Rough approximations we threw a lot of numbers around but you get the jist. I think i settled on $500 down and 16.5 cents for some sort of return rate of 2200% in funny money but it sure looked impressive. Vivant did say they expect to be able to also drop the escalator clause in the near future so keep checking. ---------------These guys have done the math - if they offer something it is a winner for them.

Comments in bold within the text

I've heard the up to 2.9% has not been implimented yet. Has any actual multi year vivant customer chimed in yet?
You say the enphase microinverter pitch is BS? He quoted it. He knew it was a major selling point to me. He could tell I'm a bit knowledgeable. Do you really think he was just going to quote enphase then put something else on the roof and hope I didn't notice?

I have since also talked to sunrun through costco. Still waiting on a proposal but the contract is supposed to be no escalator, solar edge with power optimizes. Lease with preset monthly numbers. Preset buyout options at anytime along the contract and a preset few thousand buyout at end of term. No market price TBD.

Because of my current tax situation I'm leaning against purchase and more towards a prepaid lease/ppa rolled into a HELOC. I know everyone seems against these generally but I find it funny that many times one of the main reasons to be for outright purchase is the 30% tax credit. Well so far every lease up front purchase price has been about 30% less that any cash purchase so how it the point at all valid. With a prepaid lease I get the 30% price cut, without paperwork, without waiting on my tax status, without paying higher upfront then still taking my prepaid amount and writing off the interest as a heloc. I'm jumping the gun here a bit I know but if the sunrun quotes out like he was saying it could be a winner.
One negative is I don't see sunrun mentioned alot. Any input out there?

[PVpower]

I just spent much time investigating leasing, PPA, or purchase of a system. For me, in NY with the incentives here, it really came out advantageous to purchase as opposed to any PPA or lease. I think PPA is a good option, that probably will save you money, but buying has much better long term financial benefits.

[russ]

I guess you didn't understand - quote your previous post, "I did like the quality of the system and they were offering enphase microinverters. Certainly a step up from a commodity system." I realize that is what the salesman told you but it is so much BS - No inverters are a commodity - panels are far closer to that status.