Need Help, Deciding between 2 systems in S. CA

[sdchrgrboy]

I have narrowed it down to 2 systems in So CA (San Diego) both fairly close in price. I will be puchasing the system. Install with be with minimal shading, maybe slight in winter. Panels angled facing south.
System 1
26 SolarWorld SW-265 panels
26 Enphase M215 inverters
$28,746

System 2
26 SunEdison F265KyC panels
26 Enphase M250 inverters
$28,032

When speaking with installer #1, they told me that the M250's the inverter that installer #2 paired with thier suystem 9Same watt panels) are slightly oversized and can create an excess amount of distribution space and lessen the power output. My feeling is why not have the larger inverter? I know at 80% I am only outputing 212W which is in the M215's range, But in SD we get a lot of full sun days and if I do get closer to 90% 238w, will the M215's be too small?

I belive the SolarWorld panels are a better panel. I have the option of getting a silver frame. Was also told by them that the black on black tend to create an extreme amount of heat that can be harmful to the unit and cause the effiicency to deteriorate on a daily basis.

As this is a big investment, I want to make the right decision and was hoping that someone may have some input.
Thank you.

[Naptown]

Both panels are at the fringe of the 215 rating.
There will be almost no clipping on the 250.
Black frame silver frame both equal for performance.

White back sheet perhaps a bit more production as cells are translucent and a bit of reflected light might help.
Between black and white back sheet appearance is the big difference.

[SanDiego_installer]

Wo Wo Wo. Please throw away those two quotes and start over. $4.17/Watt for solar in 2013? Ouch.

Even for micro-inverters that is way to high. Unless you have shade, consider an SMA inverter. These inverters are up to 98.5% efficient and are backed by the leading inverter company in the world.

Avoid Solarworld and SunEdison. Go with a name brand like Sharp or LG. Look for sub $3.50/Watt pricing. Ask how they do their roof attachments. If they don't mention flashings, send them packing.

Good luck.

[Naptown]

Wo Wo Wo. Please throw away those two quotes and start over. $4.17/Watt for solar in 2013? Ouch.

Even for micro-inverters that is way to high. Unless you have shade, consider an SMA inverter. These inverters are up to 98.5% efficient and are backed by the leading inverter company in the world.

Avoid Solarworld and SunEdison. Go with a name brand like Sharp or LG. Look for sub $3.50/Watt pricing. Ask how they do their roof attachments. If they don't mention flashings, send them packing.

Good luck.

Suggestion
Tone down the pitch by 80%.

[albert436]

Wo Wo Wo. Please throw away those two quotes and start over. $4.17/Watt for solar in 2013? Ouch.

Even for micro-inverters that is way to high. Unless you have shade, consider an SMA inverter. These inverters are up to 98.5% efficient and are backed by the leading inverter company in the world.

Avoid Solarworld and SunEdison. Go with a name brand like Sharp or LG. Look for sub $3.50/Watt pricing. Ask how they do their roof attachments. If they don't mention flashings, send them packing.

Good luck.

Just wondering what is the problem with Solarworld?

[J.P.M.]

I have narrowed it down to 2 systems in So CA (San Diego) both fairly close in price. I will be puchasing the system. Install with be with minimal shading, maybe slight in winter. Panels angled facing south.
System 1
26 SolarWorld SW-265 panels
26 Enphase M215 inverters
$28,746

System 2
26 SunEdison F265KyC panels
26 Enphase M250 inverters
$28,032

When speaking with installer #1, they told me that the M250's the inverter that installer #2 paired with thier suystem 9Same watt panels) are slightly oversized and can create an excess amount of distribution space and lessen the power output. My feeling is why not have the larger inverter? I know at 80% I am only outputing 212W which is in the M215's range, But in SD we get a lot of full sun days and if I do get closer to 90% 238w, will the M215's be too small?

I belive the SolarWorld panels are a better panel. I have the option of getting a silver frame. Was also told by them that the black on black tend to create an extreme amount of heat that can be harmful to the unit and cause the effiicency to deteriorate on a daily basis.

As this is a big investment, I want to make the right decision and was hoping that someone may have some input.
Thank you.

1.) Conserve, read, study, ask questions. Don't be in a huge hurry. You have some time. Be deliberate.
2.) If your orientation tilt and shading are as you say, either system, as a SWAG will probably give you about 10,000 to 10,500kWhrs./yr. Depending on where you are in S.D., that will probably cost you something like $2,200-$2,500/yr. ( for example, non T.O.U., inland). For about 6500 to 7000 of those kWhrs., depending on your situation - all electric/inland/coast/T.O.U., etc., you'll be charged the lowest rate (tiers 1 & 2) something like $.162/kWhr. or ~~$1100 of the total bill. That's the part that may not be cost effective to replace w/ solar, at least not all of it.
3.) After CSI rebate & 30% fed. credit, you'll be out about $19-$20k.
4.) Speaking of CSI - check the website and download the database listing all the jobs in CA since 2007. Sort by date, sort by panel, etc. You'll quickly find that $4.00/Watt before rebates is way too high, at least around here. Your leaving a lot of $$ on the table and can probably get same/comparable performance, quality and warranty for a lot less. More like $3.40-$3.60 for reputable panels. W/no/minor shade issues consider saving yourself more $$'s with a string inverter. Pros/cons string/vs. micros. Do the homework.
5.) Save the most by cutting back on your use and sizing the system to replace about 70 to 80% of the remaining load. That will leave you with the smallest bill and the smallest and probably the most cost effective solar.
6.) There are lots of good panels and other equipment. LG and Kyocera are two other names folks in my neighborhood seem to like.

[itnetpro]

I have a setup here near Philadelphia, PA using 40 Canadian Solar 250w CS6P matched with M215 Inverters. The M215 will clip (Max) at 225w. Your M250s will clip at 250w. It depends on a couple factors. Mine have never all clipped at 225w but I have had up 6 clip at 225w at the same time for a sort period of time. I would consider my setup well matched and not worth the extra cost of the M250. From what I have read on a paper that was written on this very subject matching the M215 with a 265w panel would be a reasonable setup. You have to ask yourself how often per year will you clip your entire array and for how long. Make the installer actually show you examples from your area running the M215 with 265w panels. Should be easy enough to see clipping from the regional arrays in your area. I would suspect that extra 25w you may generate for short periods of times during the year just might not be worth the extra cost you will spend. Remember, the warmer you panels the less efficient they will run. Clipping on my panels only happens when the weather outside is below 50 degrees and during mid day only a few times a year. If you are in an area where your outside temp averages in the 70s year round there is a good chance your 265w panels will never clip using M215 Inverters.

John

I have narrowed it down to 2 systems in So CA (San Diego) both fairly close in price. I will be puchasing the system. Install with be with minimal shading, maybe slight in winter. Panels angled facing south.
System 1
26 SolarWorld SW-265 panels
26 Enphase M215 inverters
$28,746

System 2
26 SunEdison F265KyC panels
26 Enphase M250 inverters
$28,032

When speaking with installer #1, they told me that the M250's the inverter that installer #2 paired with thier suystem 9Same watt panels) are slightly oversized and can create an excess amount of distribution space and lessen the power output. My feeling is why not have the larger inverter? I know at 80% I am only outputing 212W which is in the M215's range, But in SD we get a lot of full sun days and if I do get closer to 90% 238w, will the M215's be too small?

I belive the SolarWorld panels are a better panel. I have the option of getting a silver frame. Was also told by them that the black on black tend to create an extreme amount of heat that can be harmful to the unit and cause the effiicency to deteriorate on a daily basis.

As this is a big investment, I want to make the right decision and was hoping that someone may have some input.
Thank you.

[AquaLoco]

1.) Conserve, read, study, ask questions. Don't be in a huge hurry. You have some time. Be deliberate.
2.) If your orientation tilt and shading are as you say, either system, as a SWAG will probably give you about 10,000 to 10,500kWhrs./yr. Depending on where you are in S.D., that will probably cost you something like $2,200-$2,500/yr. ( for example, non T.O.U., inland). For about 6500 to 7000 of those kWhrs., depending on your situation - all electric/inland/coast/T.O.U., etc., you'll be charged the lowest rate (tiers 1 & 2) something like $.162/kWhr. or ~~$1100 of the total bill. That's the part that may not be cost effective to replace w/ solar, at least not all of it.
3.) After CSI rebate & 30% fed. credit, you'll be out about $19-$20k.
4.) Speaking of CSI - check the website and download the database listing all the jobs in CA since 2007. Sort by date, sort by panel, etc. You'll quickly find that $4.00/Watt before rebates is way too high, at least around here. Your leaving a lot of $$ on the table and can probably get same/comparable performance, quality and warranty for a lot less. More like $3.40-$3.60 for reputable panels. W/no/minor shade issues consider saving yourself more $$'s with a string inverter. Pros/cons string/vs. micros. Do the homework.
5.) Save the most by cutting back on your use and sizing the system to replace about 70 to 80% of the remaining load. That will leave you with the smallest bill and the smallest and probably the most cost effective solar.
6.) There are lots of good panels and other equipment. LG and Kyocera are two other names folks in my neighborhood seem to like.

JPM - Great post, thank you.

[J.P.M.]

JPM - Great post, thank you.

Thank you. Opinions vary.