A reasonable Solar Retail Plan in Texas?

[t5800512]

I live in a Dallas suburb, and I'm looking for an energy retailer that offers a reasonable Surplus Power Purchase buy back program. At this current time, Green Mountain's Renewal Rewards solar program is only available with a high price retail plan; 11.2 cents at 500 kWh, 10.9 at 1000 kWh, and 10.8 cents for 2000 kWh. No Bueno!

In my area, Green Mountain, TXU and Reliant seem to be the only retailers offering to purchase surplus PV power. I have now told all of them to go pound sand because of their high rates. I would rather pay 8 cents and give away my excess power.

I now have to switch back to my 8 cent retailer because Green Mountain slammed me. My contract with my current provider (Summer Energy) was up on 7/31. I told Green Mountain to start my service on August 1st, thinking I had time to cancel them if I found a better deal. Long story shortened, I originally signed up for a GM solar plan with a high of 9.5 cents per kWh. However I just found out that they switched me on the 22nd. I see in some reviews that this is their MO. I will be so pissed if I get an early termination fee because of GM. I knew to avoid GM because of their unscrupulous business practices, but I'm getting desperate to find a decent surplus power buy back plan in Texas.

Does anyone know a retailer that is offering a decent PV plan? I don't expect to get any money back, but I would like to bank my excess for later use.

[BioTech]

I am in Texas also and those three are the only providers in Texas that will buy back excess power. I use Green Mountain and have not had a problem with them at all. You can use this site to find out who does buy power in texas and the rates.

http://www.powertochoose.com/en-us/Plan/Offers

BioTech

[t5800512]

Hey BioTech,

Thank you for the reply. What rates are you getting from Green Mountain?

Thanks,
Scott

[BioTech]

Under 1000KW used a month its .112 but they buy back at the same rate up to 500kw each month. Anything i put back over the 500kw is at halt that price. I use most of my power i Produce during during the day. I average in the summer to put back to the grid about 600-700 kw each month (depends if i work from home or not). I have a 10.2 KW system, 42 panels.

BioTech

[Sunking]

Texas does not have Net Meterin glaws thus utilities are not required to do anything thank God. That is one reason why we have dirt cheap electric rates.

[t5800512]

BioTech, you have a large system. I will have 7560 Watts when I get the rest of my system put together. It got too hot on the roof to finish, so I will have a fall project. I have (14) of (27) 280 watt panels installed.

So, how does it work. You collect credits in the summer to use the rest of the year. I don't expect to produce much more than I use on a daily basis. I will still be purchasing the larger part of my electric needs. So, I'm sensitive to the price I will be paying. I have been on an 8 cent flat rate. Now I'm looking at 11 + cents with my PV system. I hate to pay 35 percent more for my power so that I can save 20 percent with my solar system. So, I'm hoping someone will be able to give me some ideas.

[BioTech]

I have Oncor (they give good rebates plus you get federal on top) as my power distribution company and Green Mountain as the REP (who I pay). Under Oncor you have a meter that has two readings in-flow(from the grid) and out-flow(excess power back to the grid). Those readings are read once a month when they generating my bill.

Lets say During July my Solar System will produce about 1600 KW of power for the entire month. When my system is producing power I use some of that or all of it at any given time it is producing. The excess I don't use is put back onto the grid in the form of credits to the out-flow meter part. I have only put back during the entire month 600 kw of power but used 1000kw of that power my self. The 1000kw i did use of my solar I am not charged at all its free (minus what i paid for the solar system). Any excess I did put back is calculated on my bill but not credited till the next month in the form of a credit. So for the 600 kw that rolled over to August i will see it as two credits due to the two rates of credits. The first 500 kw will be at full price for the power rate of July .112 per kw. Then anything over 500kw i am credited at 50%. So the other 100kw I get full credit for only 50Kw due to the rate scheme of Green Mountain. I get credit for what I did not use but the first 500 at 100% and the rest above 500kw at 50%. Now thats only the solar, the in-flow from the grid I use at night and when my solar is under performing I get a bill for that in July. So this month that will be about 650kw total for the month. So in the End for July I will only pay .112 cents per kw for the 650 (in-flow) and then next month I pay for Aug lets say 650kw and then get credit for 500kw at full price and 100kw at reduced by 50%. so my Aug bill is very low just he meters cost and such at around 17.70$. This keeps going through the year some months i pay nothing due to credits from some months that are paid in full and have excess still on them. Some months in summer are very small about 10-25$ it depend.

Hopes this helps but may be hard to follow with out taking in person.

BioTech

[t5800512]

A little confusing, but I got it. Thank you for explaining it to me.

So in the fall, when your solar drops off, your A/C does also. How does that work out for you? Or maybe you have not seen a fall yet. When was your system installed?

[t5800512]

BioTech, it is great talking to someone in my area that has experience. I will not be getting credits, and I will not be producing as much power as you. Do you think it will be worth it for me to sign up for the Green Mountain Renewable Rewards solar plan? The 11.2 cents is sticker shock because I have been paying an 8 cent flat rate.

[BioTech]

Its up to you, I know we had 8.3 cents before we signed up and lost that but wanted the credits. Most of the providers in my area now are around .10 now. Just look at the break down of the prices most advertise the 8 cents but that if you use more then 2000kw a month. My Greenenrgy goes down to 10 if i use more then 2000kw in a month also. I am on month to month so can change at any time.


Just look and see if at any point you think you will be feeding the grid at any point.

BioTech

[t5800512]

Yea, as my meter gets re-programmed I will be able to get a better idea how it would work. The rates have gone up in the two weeks I have been looking. It could have gotten an 8.3 flat rate, but now most are getting to be over 11 cents for 500 kWh, like you said.

I'm currently month to month with GM at 9.5 for 500 kWh. That was supposed to be a Solar Buy Back plan and to have started August 1st. But they slammed me, taking me off my 8 cent plan ahead of time. I better not get an early cancellation fee. And guess what, no solar included in the solar plan. As you might have guessed, I already have a dislike for Green Mountain.

If I could get back on an 8 cent flat rate plan, I might just skip the Surplus Power Purchase Agreements all together and just settle for offsetting my useage.

Sorry, I think I may have repeated myself some.

[BioTech]

Also in Texas once your interconnect agreement is approved it takes up to two months before the credits show up from ERCOT. I had mine approved before the solar was installed so it was a no brainer only had half a month that i feed to the grid for free. They got the free energy from us. I really did not care at the time due to being locked in with Gexa at the time. Also got the big check from Oncor for the solar install $12,900 (maxed Oncor's rebate) .


Also they totally replaced my old smartmeter with a new one set to all 00000's. Was nice to see how it grows the outflow is just about the same as the in-flow. Just wish it was true net metering so it always would stay at 0

BioTEch

[Sunking]

I live just north of you in Frisco/Prosper area and been in the utility and electrical biz for 33 years. Texas is deregulated which is kind of silly because all the power in DFW and surrounding area is all generated and distributed by TXU. All others including OnCore which is owned and operated by TXU are Middleman. Works out good for TXU because they do not have to hassle with billing and all the red tape required doing so. The e eRetailors like OnCore. Green Mountain, Champion etc do the paper work, billing, send bils, collect fees and take a cut. TXU sells to them at wholesale rate, and the Retailers add a profit.

As I stated earlier Texas has no Net Metering Laws so they can just about anything they want. Now with that said Green Mountain does offer Grid interactive but they do not Net Meter in the true since. For those that do Grid Interactive pay a higher rate of about 10 to 11 cents. Your neighbors pay about 8-cents if they are smart and shopped aound. I am at 7.9 cents per Kwh. Electric rates are expected to go lower in the next 4 years because of cheap Natural Gas and Coal prices.

With Green Mountain Energy you are always going to have a bill. The system is set up that way. YOu may save 50% or slightly more per month, but in the end you will likely never break even in TX. It might make you feel better, but lighter in your pockets. Also take into consideration adding a Solar PV system is negative equity on your home. If it cost you $30K, it only adds about $7.5 to $10K on your home value.

[BioTech]

I live just north of you in Frisco/Prosper area and been in the utility and electrical biz for 33 years. Texas is deregulated which is kind of silly because all the power in DFW and surrounding area is all generated and distributed by TXU. All others including OnCore which is owned and operated by TXU are Middleman. Works out good for TXU because they do not have to hassle with billing and all the red tape required doing so. The e eRetailors like OnCore. Green Mountain, Champion etc do the paper work, billing, send bils, collect fees and take a cut. TXU sells to them at wholesale rate, and the Retailers add a profit.

As I stated earlier Texas has no Net Metering Laws so they can just about anything they want. Now with that said Green Mountain does offer Grid interactive but they do not Net Meter in the true since. For those that do Grid Interactive pay a higher rate of about 10 to 11 cents. Your neighbors pay about 8-cents if they are smart and shopped aound. I am at 7.9 cents per Kwh. Electric rates are expected to go lower in the next 4 years because of cheap Natural Gas and Coal prices.

With Green Mountain Energy you are always going to have a bill. The system is set up that way. YOu may save 50% or slightly more per month, but in the end you will likely never break even in TX. It might make you feel better, but lighter in your pockets. Also take into consideration adding a Solar PV system is negative equity on your home. If it cost you $30K, it only adds about $7.5 to $10K on your home value.

Dont know who you are but from what you just stated I dont think you have a solar system or maybe you do (Bought one of the kits from harber freight )


Most of what you just said is wrong or misleading. Oncor is not a REP(retail electric provider) they can not bill customers. Oncor maintains the power lines and reads the meters, By law they can not bill a custoemer thats where the REP's come in TXU, Green Mountain, Gexa and others. Yes Oncor was a spinn off of TXU but they are not the same company in any way.

http://www.bounceenergy.com/articles/texas-electricity/texas-retail-electricity-provider

or

http://www.ercot.com/services/rq/tdsp/

As for the rates and net metering. Yes its true Texas does not have a true net metering, but you can still have a 0$ bill like have had. For the home value you are just reading and talking about myths. Yes you solar array will increase you home value but by law will not increase your value as to taxes. Thats where that myth comes from.

Please show me where you can get 7.9 cents per kw? That was around about 3 years ago and since then it has be a steady increase in rates. If they do advertise a low rate look closer at the terms of service most give the lowest rate when you use more then 2000KW a month or will change the next month you are on that contract.

The value into solar is their in Texas you just need to make sure you know what you are buying and talking about. My system Cost 31,000 to install but I did not pay that price for the 10.2 kw system. Oncor rebated 12,900 of that fee and then I Got a 30% tax credit ontop of the balnce which was another credit of 5,430. This placed my out of pocket expense to be $12,670 for a 10.2kw system with Enphase Micro-inverters. So for that it will take me about 6 years to break even but I broker even at the start. I basicly prepaid my electric for the first 6 years, due to me no longer paying the $180-$220 a month electric bills. After the 6 years its all free. You can look at it as a prepaid electirc or an investment, but thats if the rates stay where they are at now. I have seen the rates-go up and not down in the past 5 years and the future they are just going to go up.

http://www.takealoadofftexas.com/index.aspx?id=solar-pv-homes

BioTech

[russ]

Dont know who you are but from what you just stated I dont think you have a solar system or maybe you do (Bought one of the kits from harber freight )Funny - funny haha.


Most of what you just said is wrong or misleading. Oncor is not a REP(retail electric provider) they can not bill customers. Oncor maintains the power lines and reads the meters, By law they can not bill a custoemer thats where the REP's come in TXU, Green Mountain, Gexa and others. Yes Oncor was a spinn off of TXU but they are not the same company in any way.If you read Dunking'spost you would see that is what he said - but you hurried to get off on your green rant

Read before getting too carried away.