Wildfire Electric Backup

[oregon_phil]

Our wildfire season in Oregon last summer was historic. Our wildfire smoke lasted a week. Smoke and ash made solar electric generation virtually non-existent. Fortunately, our power company did not shut off our power during 90F plus weather. It's my understanding that electric and gas will be shutoff if I am in a mandatory evacuation zone.

I'm guessing there are situations where power is shutoff but evacuation is not mandatory. And it's hot and smoky outside.

What electric backup solutions are people using to address wildfires and utility power shutdowns? Batteries? Generators?

I'm new to this and never thought I would have to ask since we usually get so much rain up here.

Any input you can give would be appreciated. thanks.

[SunEagle]

Our wildfire season in Oregon last summer was historic. Our wildfire smoke lasted a week. Smoke and ash made solar electric generation virtually non-existent. Fortunately, our power company did not shut off our power during 90F plus weather. It's my understanding that electric and gas will be shutoff if I am in a mandatory evacuation zone.

I'm guessing there are situations where power is shutoff but evacuation is not mandatory. And it's hot and smoky outside.

What electric backup solutions are people using to address wildfires and utility power shutdowns? Batteries? Generators?

I'm new to this and never thought I would have to ask since we usually get so much rain up here.

Any input you can give would be appreciated. thanks.

Batteries will work for small loads and can be charged when you have the grid , a generator or solar. IMO a dual fuel (gasoline, propane) generator will give you a lot more power to run big loads and a choice of fuel type.

While I have a couple of small solar/battery systems I also have a 12kw dual fuel generator that should cover half my house loads.

You never know when the power will go out during hurricane season here in sunny Florida.

[chrisski]

For extremely short outages, I have a 400 watt inverter powered by a 100 AH battery and 400 watts of panels, but that is really just to charge phones and maybe an LED lamp for the night.

I've got a gas 2200 watt and a gas 5Kw generator. Each of those could power a large appliance. I've got enough propane to cook for weeks.

Other than that, it would be off to the RV where I would have a fridge and freezer about 1/5 the size of the house, but we'd be comfortable for a few days. That has a 12 volt system, 458 ah of batteries, and 1 kw of panels.

I don't ever remember the power flickering in central AZ once in the five years I've lived here. I do here that 20 years ago we overbuilt our electric grid to plan for the future, but that has not kept up with the growth we are at now and our Power Company mentioned in an E-mail that Brown Outs were a possibility and asked us to keep air conditioning at 80 to help.

[Mike90250]

I'm off grid and use my regular diesel generator.
Pic at 1pm with low power LED lights in the 2 sheds
20200908_133527.png

[SunEagle]

I'm off grid and use my regular diesel generator.
Pic at 1pm with low power LED lights in the 2 sheds
20200908_133527.png

How close did the fire get to you?

[Mike90250]

This fire was about 40 miles away and 3 days of smoke, this was the worse day. And ash !!

[oregon_phil]

Thanks everybody for the input. Mike's situation is what I had in the summer. I understand that Mike is offgrid.

For those on grid with generators, is your house wired for hook up or do you run extension cords to the device needing power?

How important is dual fuel do you think?

Thanks!

[chrisski]

My father has a hookup by the circuit breaker box and when the power goes out, and in Maine it is out for days every year, the generator automatically turns on. The generator is run off town gas. I think it’s natural gas not propane.

He only has grid power with the generator to supplement in case of power failure.

He does not think dual fuel is important.

I have gas generators and grid power at the house. For a grid power Loss, I’d use extension cords to run appliances, and low wattage items like charging cell phones, I have 100 ah battery with 400 watt inverter and 400 watts of panels and a PWM SCC.

I may get a dual fuel conversion for one of two generators.

I think it depends on your situation I’ve been in AZ for 9 years with not even a flicker in the grid, so redundancy is not important; but my father where he will lose his power in a blizzard which means no heat every year at least once, the generator coming on to power his stuff is important.

[oregon_phil]

Thanks for the info. It's always nice to get real life data instead of a pitch from a sales person.

[SunEagle]

Thanks everybody for the input. Mike's situation is what I had in the summer. I understand that Mike is offgrid.

For those on grid with generators, is your house wired for hook up or do you run extension cords to the device needing power?

How important is dual fuel do you think?

Thanks!

I can use a 50amp receptacle that my RV is plugged into to back feed my main panel. I just need to first turn off the main incoming 200amp CB as well as non essential loads before I can start up my 12kw generator. So far I have been lucky and have not needed it because our power outages have been very short.

[Ampster]

I can use a 50amp receptacle that my RV is plugged into to back feed my main panel. I just need to first turn off the main incoming 200amp CB as well as non essential loads before I can start up my 12kw generator. So far I have been lucky and have not needed it because our power outages have been very short.

That would require wiring a suicide plug. Interlock kits are inexpensive and a correct generator connector and another circuit breaker are worth the added safety of doing it right.
I am sure that is what you meant to describe?

[SunEagle]

That would require wiring a suicide plug. Interlock kits are inexpensive and a correct generator connector and another circuit breaker are worth the the added safety of doing it right.
I am sure that is what you meant to describe.

Yes. I could install a true generator interlock kit but I have yet to do so because I have yet to need it. I also have over 40 years in the electrical power industry so I have written an action plan showing what to turn off and what to turn on before I energize the gen set. I feel it is still safe if I need to backfeed my home with the gen set.

Or I can just go into my RV and use that gen set to provide power and light for me and my wife if we lose the grid for a long period.

[Ampster]

Yes. I could install a true generator interlock kit but I have yet to do so because I have yet to need it. I also have over 40 years in the electrical power industry so I have written an action plan showing what to turn off and what to turn on before I energize the gen set..

I do not doubt your expertise but i thought the assumption on this forum was that someone without your expertise might do that and be injured.

My comment was not intended to be critical of you but to warn others of the risk and explain in more detail so that less experienced readers would understand the risk. There is a reason they are called suicide plugs. I don't know for sure but there is probably a code section that covers that situation. Does your detailed action plan eliminate the need to comply with the code? For sure your action plan is a good risk management strategy, and I applaud you for that.

[SunEagle]

I do not doubt your expertise but i thought the assumption on this forum was that someone without your expertise might do that and be injured.

My comment was not intended to be critical of you but to warn others of the risk and explain in more detail so that less experienced readers would understand the risk. There is a reason they are called suicide plugs. I don't know for sure but there is probably a code section that covers that situation. Does your detailed action plan eliminate the need to comply with the code? For sure your action plan is a good risk management strategy, and I applaud you for that.

I agree with you. Safety is important. Thank you for providing the information that it can be unsafe to use a suicide plug with a generator.

Unfortunately most people that have issues with generators tend to not use them outside and get hurt or die from carbon monoxide poisoning.

[oregon_phil]

I decided the best solution for my situation was a NG generator with a service entrance ATS that connects to my main panel. Only one additional contactor is needed to isolate my SMA inverter from the generator. Since I had all my electrical devices on a spreadsheet with voltage, amps, duration used and time of day used, generator selection was very easy.

I looked at batteries, but they are very expensive and would not recharge during wildfire event (no sunlight for days on the solar panels). My goal was to get the least expensive solution to run my AC and HVAC air filtering with wildfire debris events. Thank to everybody for the information provided.