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Fuji f-wave 319v Roll Up panels - for a camper

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  • Fuji f-wave 319v Roll Up panels - for a camper

    So there is this guy, Viktor from Netherlands who sells these roll up solar panels on eBay, he's been selling them for a few years and I've read some bits from people who have bought from him before. The panels look great but the voltage is 319v which is more than I'd like inside my camper. They are designed to be used for grid lecky.

    One idea would be to use a step down inverter to take the voltage from 319v to a more workable 12v to charge my batteries so my set up inside my van would look like:

    Split charge relay from my engines alternator feeding 2 X 6v 230ah deep cycle batteries wired in series to make 12v 230ah.
    Also feeding the battery will be 3 X 100w roll up panels with a step down converter and mppt to take the voltage from 319v to 12v
    From the battery I will have a 1500w pure sine wave inverter with fuse box and plugs for domestic appliances, lights etc.

    The panels are 1 3.5 meter roll made up of 4 smaller cells, made up of 68 smaller cells wired together inside a flexible lamination. Am I right in thinking that if I separate the 4 cells from inside each panel I can rewire them to decrease the voltage and increase current?

    im feel like the cells would be rewired in series and parallel but I'm new to this so I'm just throwing some mad scientist ideas about.

    id like to be able to lose the step down converter from the system because the idea of stepping down the power from 319v to charge a 12v battery then taking it back up to 240v with the psw inverter seems like a lot of messing around, bulky equipment and an inefficient way of doing things.

    id love to know what you think and if anybody has tried the roll up panels before?
    thanks!



    Edit- here is a link to 319v - 12v Dc-dc step down inverter, custome made by the seller specifically for these panels

    https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F352214109058
    Last edited by Sonneshine; 04-18-2018, 06:58 AM.

  • #2
    i'd pretty much call those panels a Dead End.. Even rolled up, if any light gets on enough of it to energize the panel, you have voltage over 50VDC on the leads, ready to bite you.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount (2) | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister

    Comment


    • #3
      Save your money. They are film panels, and all film panels are dead in 5 years. The UV light destroys them. Ironic the sun destroys solar panels.

      The other thing can be worked around is the high voltage and high voltage is a good thing. You just have to use a 600 volt charge controller which they make today if you can afford them.

      Now you know why the call them F-Wave, you fricking wave your money goodby.
      MSEE, PE

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi Sunking , I was reading some of your posts and you seem to know your stuff , so I am asking for a bit of advice please . I live in Australia and I am building a weekend shack that will be off grid , I have 26 Hareonsolar panels 250 Watts, 30.4 Volts, (open circuit Voltage is 37.51 Volts ) I'll probably only use 12 or 20 depending if I go 3KW or 5KW . My main concern is I don't know if I should go 24 or 48 Volts and what batteries I should use , I know this is a very open question but I've been told that 400amp hours is what I should be aiming for in my situation and usage , any advice would be helpful , thanks .

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Chevy Paul View Post
          Hi I have 26 Hareonsolar panels 250 Watts, 30.4 Volts, (open circuit Voltage is 37.51 Volts ) I'll probably only use 12 or 20 depending if I go 3KW or 5KW . My main concern is I don't know if I should go 24 or 48 Volts and what batteries I should use
          You have unknowingly answered your own question. Only answer is 48 volts or higher.

          Largest MPPT Charge Controllers you can buy is in the 80 to 100 amps. Panel wattage is limited by battery voltage. Example an 80 Amp controller has the following input power limitations vs battery voltage.

          1000 watts @ 12 volts
          2000 watts @ 24 volts
          4000 watts @ 48 volts.

          MPPT controller are expensive. In the USA a good 80 amp controller is $600 and the 600 volt input models are $1000 plus. Sure you could use 2 controllers for a 4000 watt 24 volt system , or 4 controllers for a 12 volt 4000 watt system but you would be a damn fool. Very few models can support a 5000 watt system 48 volt system. When you select a controller, select a model with the highest Voc input you can afford with 150 Voc minimum. Higher is better and will save you a lot of money on installation and material. Even though to 600 volt models are expensive can save you money.

          As for batteries not sure I can be of much help with you being down under. You do not have the access to the higher quality batteries we have and I am not real familiar with what you have available. I know Australians use a lot of Chi-Com products, and there is not one Chi-Com product I would recommend to anyone except Chi-Coms, Russians, and Democrats in the USA. If you can find a Trojan or Rolls battery importer would be good. Sorry I cannot be of much help with batteries in your location. You can run some names and model numbers by me and I will be more than happy to tell you what I know about them.

          Good luck.

          MSEE, PE

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Sunking View Post
            Save your money. They are film panels, and all film panels are dead in 5 years. The UV light destroys them. Ironic the sun destroys solar panels.

            The other thing can be worked around is the high voltage and high voltage is a good thing. You just have to use a 600 volt charge controller which they make today if you can afford them.

            Now you know why the call them F-Wave, you fricking wave your money goodby.
            Hey fella, thanks so much for your reply!
            i don't mind so much that they will only last 5 years, they are affordable for me right now, and they also will save me having to mount a heavy and expensive roof rack to support rigid panels on top of my van.

            Aside from them being film panels that you wouldn't recommend do you think there are any other glaringly obvious problems with the set up I mentioned?







            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Mike90250 View Post
              i'd pretty much call those panels a Dead End.. Even rolled up, if any light gets on enough of it to energize the panel, you have voltage over 50VDC on the leads, ready to bite you.
              Nice one for your reply mate!

              but I don't quite understand, do you mean you can get electric shock just from touching the panel?

              Comment


              • #8
                You can get a shock from the wires. Not knowing how the panels are made, they SHOULD be insulated, but who knows. Are you going to glue them to the roof ? Or unroll them when you park ?
                Powerfab top of pole PV mount (2) | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
                || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
                || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

                solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
                gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Sonneshine View Post
                  Hey fella, thanks so much for your reply!
                  You are welcome

                  Originally posted by Sonneshine View Post
                  Aside from them being film panels that you wouldn't recommend do you think there are any other glaringly obvious problems with the set up I mentioned?
                  There is no such thing as a 319 to 12 volt Inverter. Now if you have the big bucks for a 600 volt MPPT Controller knock yourself out.





                  MSEE, PE

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sunking View Post

                    There is no such thing as a 319 to 12 volt Inverter. Now if you have the big bucks for a 600 volt MPPT Controller knock yourself out.

                    The guy on eBay custom makes the step down inverter, I'll post links so you can see...

                    edit- https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F352214109058
                    Last edited by Sonneshine; 04-18-2018, 06:58 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      He doesn't mention isolation or efficiency. Lots of switchers start with a rectifier to high voltage DC
                      and then proceed to chop it through a transformer to get the regulated, isolated voltage you want.
                      Might take just replacing the front end rectifier to build this unit. Bruce Roe

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sonneshine View Post

                        The guy on eBay custom makes the step down inverter, I'll post links so you can see...

                        edit- https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F352214109058
                        It's certainly not Certified by any industry group, so if a fire or injury occurs, no insurance will cover you

                        Powerfab top of pole PV mount (2) | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
                        || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
                        || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

                        solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
                        gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hi Sunking thanks for the reply , we do have Trojan batteries for sale in Australia . What type & model would you recommend for my application , I've been told that 400 Amp Hours would be more than enough for my usage . Also have you heard of Victron Easysolar inverters ? , that's one of the brands I'm considering to buy , thanks .

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Chevy Paul View Post
                            Hi Sunking thanks for the reply , we do have Trojan batteries for sale in Australia . What type & model would you recommend for my application , I've been told that 400 Amp Hours would be more than enough for my usage . Also have you heard of Victron Easysolar inverters ? , that's one of the brands I'm considering to buy , thanks .
                            300 watts of panels is not large enough to support a 12 volt 400 AH battery without a Battery isolator to allow you to charge from the alternator. A pair of T-105's 225 AH would be a good fit for the panel wattage. But that does not imply the battery meets your requirements.

                            MSEE, PE

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi Sunking , my intention is to run 3000 watts of panels and run a 48 volt system so I was aiming between 200- 400 amp hours on a 48 volt system . My plan is to try 200 amp hours and see if that was enough but if not I would double the amount of batteries with another separate bank giving me 400 amp hours . Just need advice on which 12 volt battery you recommend from Trojan ,thanks again .

                              Comment

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