Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Are my solar panels damaged?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Are my solar panels damaged?

    Hi folks,
    I'm in the process of installing a 7.5KW system using Solar World 270W panels. I just went and picked up my shipment and brought it back home from the trucking terminal.

    Upon inspecting the pallet of solar panels, I noticed some bending in the panels themselves. This was due to the supporting pallet not being large enough to extend to the edges of the panels and the pressure on the corners pushing down.

    Is this normal??? Will this cause any damage or break any seals? Is this acceptable?

    Notice the panels at the bottom of the stack bending. This is NOT an aberration of the camera lens but an actual bending of the panels.

    Thanks,
    Attached Files

  • #2
    They should be packed in a carton vertically not horizontally. what distributor did you order from?
    OutBack FP1 w/ CS6P-250P http://bit.ly/1Sg5VNH

    Comment


    • #3
      I bought everything from Renvu

      Comment


      • #4
        Don't know what, if any damage may or may not have occurred, but FWIW, damage or not, that palletizing, or rather lack of it, looks somewhat flimsy to me. I'm used to seeing actual pallets that have some resistance to bending stresses. If it was me, and I was at all concerned about potential damage, I'd decline to accept the shipment, file a claim w/the carrier and call them daily until the situation is resolved and have patience and persistence. Part of the back/down side of DIY is that your on your own if stuff like this happens and you don't know if it's normal/common/expected or not.

        On the other hand, there may be no significant damage. If that palletizing has produced a lot of problems, I bet there's a fair chance SolarWorld would have heard about it by now and adjusted the packaging.

        Take your best shot and your best guess, and take your chances. Maybe some installer(s) reading this will take pity and offer an informed opinion.

        Comment


        • #5
          I took lots of photos when I picked the pallet up and filed a claim with Renvu to get the process started IF (big if) there is actual damage. I'm still wondering if a small bow (bend) in the panels will have any effect, even if they'll look funny or even be visible when all racked up with the other panels.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Murby View Post
            I took lots of photos when I picked the pallet up and filed a claim with Renvu to get the process started IF (big if) there is actual damage. I'm still wondering if a small bow (bend) in the panels will have any effect, even if they'll look funny or even be visible when all racked up with the other panels.
            Unless there has been yielding of the AL from elongation or compressive bending due to some local buckling buckling which is permanent, deformation is not likely. One other thing that may be of some (??) guidance : check the spec sheet for the panel and see if a max. applied dead load is listed. If the weight of the stack is less than the listed load, that's a good sign. There is a way to estimate possible allowable cyclic bending or jostling during shipping from the spec sheet listed allowable wind load, but that's a pretty sketchy way to do it, and probably not very reliable.

            All the bending also says nothing about how the attachment of the cells to the frame may handle relative frame distortion(s) or cyclic vibrations. In situ, the frames probably won't vibrate as much as the panel with vibration going from panel face to frame. In transport, the imposed vibration will be going the other way, from frame to panel face. That probably won't make a difference, but I'm not familiar with the attachment details.

            I'd guess that if there is any damage to any of the panels, there's a possibility that it may be unseen and not discovered until installation and system checkout for continuity, etc., or at startup. If so, that could turn into a figure pointing cluster function.

            Comment


            • #7
              There is a lot of pressure on the panel manufacturers to keep removing costs, and they are constantly coming up with ways to cheapen up the packaging. Solar pallets are are real joke considering how much weight there is and what a pallet of panels cost. Your pics obviously show that the original pallet got ruined and some warehouse dummy just stuck it on a standard (too small) pallet and you'll be very lucky if there are no damaged panels. You did the right thing by making an immediate claim. I've had similar troubles with deliveries coming from Renvu myself.
              All the weight of a pallet of solar panels is riding on the frames along the perimeter of the pallet. If the load shifts even one inch, it can fall of the edge of the pallet and now you have all that weight on the glass of the panels. Most manufacturers stack the panels on edge so they can carry the load better, but some still lay them flat and then rely on crummy little corner chocks to hold them in line.
              Always, always, always closely inspect pallets of solar panels when they are delivered. Just a little "dent" caused by a careless forklift driver is all it takes to shatter a panel. You have to catch it at delivery or the trucking company will probably weasel out of any claim. And your insurance is no good either as they will say its the trucking company's responsibility. I'm about to the point of telling the truck drivers, "No - you're going to have to hang around and wait until we unpack each and every panel to make sure you guys didn't damage them" But its not the truckers fault so much as the cheap, crummy packaging the manufacturer's are getting away with. SolarWorld is among the worst in my experience.
              The good news is that when they replace damaged panels, they will allow you to keep the damaged ones which still work to a great degree. Don't know how long a panel with shattered glass will last, but I've got two of them running my solar well pump going on 7 years!
              BSEE, R11, NABCEP, >1200kW installed

              Comment


              • #8
                Thank you so much for the replies.. very informative. Looks like I'll have to start a conversation with Solarworld on Monday as well as Renvu....

                How is renvu about handling things like this?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Looks like a couple extra 1x4's in the center of the pallet are the culprits - someone made off with the nice pallet and gave you the dud.
                  Powerfab top of pole PV mount (2) | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
                  || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
                  || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

                  solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
                  gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    For what it is worth, this is what a Canadian Solar pallet + 2 extra panels look like, as delivered to me by Tandem Solar. I was surprised to see QC data listed for each panel by serial number..
                    Pallet-cropped.jpg
                    Pallet label-reduced.jpg
                    Last edited by sensij; 04-16-2017, 04:55 PM.
                    CS6P-260P/SE3000 - http://tiny.cc/ed5ozx

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by sensij View Post
                      For what it is worth, this is what a Canadian Solar pallet + 2 extra panels look like, as delivered to me by Tandem Solar. I was surprised to see QC data listed for each panel by serial number
                      Not on you, but like a lot of other things, those pallets are sure an example of how things sure ain't what they used to be. Looks like stacked 3/4" OSB.
                      Last edited by J.P.M.; 04-16-2017, 06:47 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Part of the problem with shipping pallets these days is that international shipping rules now forbid real wood to be used in pallet construction. This to eliminate the importation of foreign bugs and pests. Plywood is allowed to be used because it is treated and thought to be bug-free so most pallets are made from built up plywood as in the Canadian Solar pallets. They are not very strong though, and more often than not - are in pieces by the time they get to me.
                        Another problem they have is they leave out the bottom "boards" so that when forklifting them endwise there is nothing holding the pallet down to the forks. If you have standard length forks and are lifting these long pallets from the end, all the weight is balanced on the tip of the forks on the middle board of the pallet and it can can easily rotate and just fall off the forks cause there are no bottom "boards" capturing it on to the forks. Don't ask how I know about this! We've learned to be very, very careful when handling these solar panel pallets, but most trucking companies and their forklift jockeys - not so much.
                        BSEE, R11, NABCEP, >1200kW installed

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by solarix View Post
                          Part of the problem with shipping pallets these days is that international shipping rules now forbid real wood to be used in pallet construction. This to eliminate the importation of foreign bugs and pests. Plywood is allowed to be used because it is treated and thought to be bug-free so most pallets are made from built up plywood as in the Canadian Solar pallets. They are not very strong though, and more often than not - are in pieces by the time they get to me.
                          Another problem they have is they leave out the bottom "boards" so that when forklifting them endwise there is nothing holding the pallet down to the forks. If you have standard length forks and are lifting these long pallets from the end, all the weight is balanced on the tip of the forks on the middle board of the pallet and it can can easily rotate and just fall off the forks cause there are no bottom "boards" capturing it on to the forks. Don't ask how I know about this! We've learned to be very, very careful when handling these solar panel pallets, but most trucking companies and their forklift jockeys - not so much.
                          I learn something every day. Thanx. Not as surprised once I think about it.

                          Regardless of the motives/origins behind the regulation(s) relative to panel material(s) and construction, sounds like an example of the law of unintended consequences. I wonder how many freight claims for damage that actually resulted from poor handling will be denied and blamed on the "Baaad gov." policies and "overregulation". Probably enough real blame for both to go around.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I have received panels stacked vertically, and horizontally, no damage. For horizontal, plastic corner blocks were
                            screwed to the skid so they could not slip out of place; these interlocked with each other and the panels so that
                            no panel could slip out of place. I have a garbage can full of these corners, till I find someone who can use them.

                            One advantage of vertical stacking, is water can't pool on panels being stored. MC4s can suffer. Bruce Roe

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by bcroe View Post
                              I have received panels stacked vertically, and horizontally, no damage. For horizontal, plastic corner blocks were
                              screwed to the skid so they could not slip out of place; these interlocked with each other and the panels so that
                              no panel could slip out of place. I have a garbage can full of these corners, till I find someone who can use them.
                              Ship them north to Minnesota. Maybe useful as part of fixturing for use by hair stylists for their customers of northern european ancestry who have ADD. OOFDA !

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X