Capacitor in place of batteries?

[muttonpig]

Yes I think you were all correct! I have returned it to china and paypal will be putting through a refund this week. Have decided to spend a bit more and go with an Enasolar GT 3kw inverter that has a DC input of 100-600v, so I can series all 10 of my panels to 450v. Made here in NZ and comes with a certificate of compliance to keep it all nice and legal, not to mention also has built in Wifi for PC monitoring.

[SunEagle]

No, but our children, or our children's children....
Q: Is it also a characteristic of a civilized society that they plant solar trees that they will not live to see fully grown?

russ just put up a new thread today concerning the PbC battery and the company that makes it getting a large contract for a trucking fleet.

The website for Axion Power also showed what looked like a large Grid Tie battery system mounted in a trailer called a Power Cube which seemed to be in use. They are not a high density type battery but will be able (according to the website) handle 1mw for 30 minutes or 100kw for 10 hours.

Maybe it won't be our children's children to see this technology.

[inetdog]

Funny thing if it proves to be real, we will never see it.

No, but our children, or our children's children....
Q: Is it also a characteristic of a civilized society that they plant solar trees that they will not live to see fully grown?

[Sunking]

15000 cycles / 365 cycles a year = 41 years.
that is one long lasting battery if it works out that way.

Well Rich as you know that is simulated and not real world results. Funny thing if it proves to be real, we will never see it.

[Naptown]

I am familiar with them. They are PbC batteries where the negative plate is a hybrid carbon lead compound. It allows a standard lead acid battery to to be discharged deeply, very high C rates, and greatly increased cycle life. It has some promise and there are a couple of manufactures just getting started making them most notable Penn'/Deka making a batch of them for a utility scale project. You can learn more here.

Orignally there were developed to compete with Lithium batteries for the EV market, but they will not fly because of the low energy density. However that is not important for RE applications. They cost slightly more than standard Pc, but much less expensive than Lithium. Sandia ran test on Deka, Axiom refused, and initial results were outstanding as Sandia estimates cycle life in excess of 15,000 cycle to 80% DOD. That could be a game changer.

15000 cycles / 365 cycles a year = 41 years.
that is one long lasting battery if it works out that way.

[Sunking]

I want one!

I wonder if they would just consider removing the capacitor for us RE guys, thereby reducing cost, yet still have the other benefits. Alas, until I see it on store shelves for mere mortals, it will be of the Un-Obtainium variety.

No it is the carbon sandwhich which protects the lead plate. Remove that and you have a standard FLA battery.

[PNjunction]

I want one!

I wonder if they would just consider removing the capacitor for us RE guys, thereby reducing cost, yet still have the other benefits. Alas, until I see it on store shelves for mere mortals, it will be of the Un-Obtainium variety.

[Sunking]

What is the intended application for this?

I am familiar with them. They are PbC batteries where the negative plate is a hybrid carbon lead compound. It allows a standard lead acid battery to to be discharged deeply, very high C rates, and greatly increased cycle life. It has some promise and there are a couple of manufactures just getting started making them most notable Penn'/Deka making a batch of them for a utility scale project. You can learn more here.

Orignally there were developed to compete with Lithium batteries for the EV market, but they will not fly because of the low energy density. However that is not important for RE applications. They cost slightly more than standard Pc, but much less expensive than Lithium. Sandia ran test on Deka, Axiom refused, and initial results were outstanding as Sandia estimates cycle life in excess of 15,000 cycle to 80% DOD. That could be a game changer.

[inetdog]

There is a blended battery called an UltraBattery from Deka. Manufactured by East Penn Manufacturing. It's both an AGM and UltraCap in one package. Not available to homeowners but it has a possible future for renewable energy storage when the trials work their way through.

What is the intended application for this? If the object is to have the cap carry the high current surges or pulses to minimize the effects of the battery's internal resistance, then it would be much better to have the ultracap at the load (inverter) end of the connecting wire, since a cap at the battery will do nothing to mitigate the voltage drop across the wire resistance.

[bonaire]

There is a blended battery called an UltraBattery from Deka. Manufactured by East Penn Manufacturing. It's both an AGM and UltraCap in one package. Not available to homeowners but it has a possible future for renewable energy storage when the trials work their way through.

[SunEagle]

Afraid you got exactly what you paid for. A Chi-Com POS. Their Advertising is a good clue it is a con job.

A. SURGE PROTECTOR:
sometimes, if you are using some heaving appliance like motor, enginee, cause the voltage up down very fast,in this moment, big amp will come into the grid inverter, easy to cause the ac mos burned, so surge protector will cut down by itself to protect the grid inverter.


B. lightning protection:
you may have experience, when meet the big lightning, the power source of the home appliance may damage,same reason, will also cause the inverter damage, in this moment the lightining protection can release thousand voltage to protect the inverter not damage.


C. HIGH SPEED AC FUSE:
now we put ac fuse outside, each inverter will come our special ac fuse, this will be broken1mini/sec, to make sure high voltage spike come in!

You are probably right on it being a piece of merde. Or just very bad English translation.

You ought to read most of the manuals that come with the Chinese made RC planes. Don't try to follow them to build your plane or you might have something that fly's backwards.

[Mike90250]

The grid tie inverter I purchased was a Powerjack PSWGT5000-28-52-220.

DO NOT use a battery with it. It's meant to run directly off PV panels with specs that match what the booklet calls for.

But since it's a Powerjack, it will likely just take your $ and stop working when it gets hot.

[Sunking]

The grid tie inverter I purchased was a Powerjack PSWGT5000-28-52-220.

Afraid you got exactly what you paid for. A Chi-Com POS. Their Advertising is a good clue it is a con job.

A. SURGE PROTECTOR:
sometimes, if you are using some heaving appliance like motor, enginee, cause the voltage up down very fast,in this moment, big amp will come into the grid inverter, easy to cause the ac mos burned, so surge protector will cut down by itself to protect the grid inverter.


B. lightning protection:
you may have experience, when meet the big lightning, the power source of the home appliance may damage,same reason, will also cause the inverter damage, in this moment the lightining protection can release thousand voltage to protect the inverter not damage.


C. HIGH SPEED AC FUSE:
now we put ac fuse outside, each inverter will come our special ac fuse, this will be broken1mini/sec, to make sure high voltage spike come in!

[muttonpig]

The grid tie inverter I purchased was a Powerjack PSWGT5000-28-52-220.

[muttonpig]

What I am concerned about is that the higher voltage from my panels may damage the inverter as it only has an input voltage range of 28-52v dc and the open circuit voltage in full sun is almost 90v. A couple of days ago I connected the dc side to the inverter before dawn and kept an eye on the dc voltage as the sun came up. When the voltage started to reach the minimum input value, the inverter started generating and dropping the input voltage below the min level and the inverter would stop generating. This continued for a while (voltage up & down, up & down) as I would expect (load, unload). But as soon as there was direct sunlight on the panels, the dc voltage shot up to about 80v and stayed there as thou there was no load? all lights were green on the inverter but there was no output. I quickly shut it down to hopefully prevent any damage. This is why I thought I might need to put in a regulator to get a steady 48 volts into the inverter.