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House lighting with 18650 batteries

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  • House lighting with 18650 batteries

    Im wondering what you all think of this idea. I bought a cheap Hp powerbank and charged it full and connect a usb 5watt led lamp to it. It burned more than 3 hours. The powerbank consists of one 18650 li-ion.

    I also did charged this powerbank with a 6volt 3wp panel. Works fine.

    I have a seperate toilet and douche cabine. So in each i installed this. Also in my bedrooms and small hall.

    In the meantime im able to make my own powerbanks with different cheap charging modules. Works also fine. Testing now for my living room with a powerbank consisting 4x18650 batteries and burning 2x7watt usb bulbs for approx 5-6hours per evening.

    You go shower 5-10 minutes and you turn off the lamp. So its sure that such a cheap setup is suitable for what i call "on-off spaces".

    I frequently read about systems for a shed or camping and i thought ..wow... Why a relatively big system???

    Anyone else experimenting with 18650 batteries for home permanent lighting, not emergency lighting (off grid lighting)???

  • #2
    They are already used in some high quality, high power, solar garden lights.
    SunnyBoy 3000 US, 18 BP Solar 175B panels.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by inetdog View Post
      They are already used in some high quality, high power, solar garden lights.
      Ok. Im wondering why dont we use such solar powered lighting inside the house as pemanent lighting??? Relatively cheap

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      • #4
        Example. This usb 5watt led bulb burns more than 3 hours after the battery is fully charged. I m still testing this to be used for my toilet, hall and bedrooms.
        Attached Files

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        • #5
          Remember that 18650 refers to a size, and not a chemistry!

          From an application standpoint, that is the wrong battery to use. You don't NEED the extreme energy density to light your led's. You are wasting the capabilites of the cell (and paying through the nose for that wasted capability), along with poor cycling life of the chemistry one usually thinks of an 18650 having. Unless of course you are playing with trash cells.

          Far better would be to use 18650 or 26650 LiFeP04's, which is a much safer li-ion chemistry than the usual junk/unsafe/grey market "pulls". They have a different nominal voltage (3.2v vs 3.7v, so pay attention) The solar garden lights that inetdog refers to use LiFeP04/LFP chemistry, and are usually 18650 in size, but sometimes you'll find them in 26650 size.

          Granted you are only using a single cell, but when you analyze it, and especially if you are going to go solar, it represents the most expensive, unsafe option out there. If you absolutely *have* to go this route for kicks, then just get a commercially made bank like an Anker Astro or similar and a 5v usb camping led light.

          The moral is that despite it's small size, when you scale up the cycle life of non-lfp li-ions, and compare it to other chemistries you could use for just a simple light, you'll be paying about 4 times at least for a cell performance capability you aren't using. Match the battery chemistry to the application for the most benefit.

          Hint about solar - even commercial outfits that say their products can be charged by solar don't think about the effects of temporary shadowing. That is, some circuits when they detect very little current flowing from the input, say from a shaded solar panel, and when the full power of an unshaded panel returns, the little regulator circuit does not recover, and limits the charge to the minimum, say 500ma max, even though much more is available again in a full sun condition.

          Those of us who do solar power our commercial power banks, check for this phenomenon to make sure that a shadowing effect will recover properly. Some combinations of banks and panels don't recover well.

          Last edited by PNjunction; 09-23-2016, 04:56 AM.

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          • #6
            BTW, do you actually KNOW what you are doing with Li-Ion?

            If you did, and you are planning on using these for interior living spaces other than just a camping hack, you'd be using LFP or LiFeP04.

            Put it this way - I won't be staying overnight at your place. Lighting up a bulb on your bench is one thing. Putting desktop bench hacks into permanent living quarter use is asking for trouble. While endangering yourself is bad enough, exposing others to that danger is quite another.

            Hint: you can still have fun. Grab some small 600-watt "jumpstarter" packs, maybe ones with a built-in inverter, and go to town....
            Last edited by PNjunction; 09-23-2016, 01:48 PM.

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            • #7
              Ive only been testing such setups as above for a week and i must say that till now its ok.

              Lithium Cobalt Oxide(LiCoO2) with cycle life of 500–1000, related to depth of discharge, load, temperature is i think ok.

              Slow charging during the day is also ok cause i burn my lamps only in the evening.

              About the costs, also ok.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by fivewin View Post
                Anyone else experimenting with 18650 batteries for home permanent lighting, not emergency lighting (off grid lighting)???
                No and never would. Why would I want to spend 20 times more for power and light, an dput my family life in danger. Are you trying to kill your kids and make it look like an accident so you can get away with it? ?
                MSEE, PE

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by PNjunction View Post
                  BTW, do you actually KNOW what you are doing with Li-Ion?

                  If you did, and you are planning on using these for interior living spaces other than just a camping hack, you'd be using LFP or LiFeP04.

                  Here is one recent video from a guy who thought he knew what he was doing with 18650's - he was no newcomer to the scene:

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHR46aEj144

                  Put it this way - I won't be staying overnight at your place. Lighting up a bulb on your bench is one thing. Putting desktop bench hacks into permanent living quarter use is asking for trouble. While endangering yourself is bad enough, exposing others to that danger is quite another.

                  Hint: you can still have fun. Grab some small 600-watt "jumpstarter" packs, maybe ones with a built-in inverter, and go to town....
                  Hey some people enjoy living in a Yurt off in the out land and those type of lights are perfect.

                  As for us spoiled brats that can't do without the internet and microwaves, well give me the Grid anytime.

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                  • #10
                    Fivewin - So you are putting a LiCo02 inside what appears to be a balsa-wood / paneling enclosure?

                    Even the most ardent flashlight guru would tell you to stop.

                    Forget the technical aspects. What you are doing is absolutely unsafe. There are a lot of little dangerous hacks that one can cobble together from bits and pieces based on specs alone - but the REAL WORLD demands that we warn you up front.

                    An unsafe environment deserves no further comment - which you asked for.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by fivewin View Post
                      Example. This usb 5watt led bulb burns more than 3 hours after the battery is fully charged. I m still testing this to be used for my toilet, hall and bedrooms.
                      Do you have a protection circuit on that battery?

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by jflorey2 View Post
                        Do you have a protection circuit on that battery?
                        Actually that battery is usually used in a steel case flash light or a metal enclosure with a proper BMS charging system with proper safety controls.

                        What fivewin is attempting would be akin to using a wick in a 55 gallon barrel of kerosene to light up his home. Sure it can be done but what if something (and it eventually will) goes wrong.

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                        • #13
                          One reason that such solar charged lights are not used indoors is that it is not light enough indoors, even during mid-day, to drive the panel. And wiring between the battery and light and an exterior mounted panel is going to be beyond the capability of most potential users.
                          SunnyBoy 3000 US, 18 BP Solar 175B panels.

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                          • #14
                            Then i dont understand why in most laptops a number of 18650 is used. Also most powerbanks for handphones consist of 18650.

                            If you charge 18650 at 4.2 (4.3 max) volt its safe.
                            Attached Files

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                            • #15
                              Again - you are building solely based on "spec-manship", and not real-world issues. The balsa-wood enclosure is a dead giveaway that you are not safe and do not know what you are doing. There is no shame admitting that, but for heaven's sake, don't fight us on safety.

                              Let me ask you these real-world questions:

                              1) Where did you get these cells from?
                              2) Who is the manufacturer?
                              3) Are they fake/gray market cells like Mondo-Fire 7000's, which are obviously wrong..
                              4) Does your cell have a cell-protection circuit at one end? And if it does, do you know if THAT isn't a fake?
                              5) Are the cells new, or have they been abused / pulled from some other device with an unknown charging history?

                              I could go on. These are questions that reputable manufacturers don't have to ask themselves. But as a DIY'er, you are a major sales TARGET FOR UNSAFE TRASH.

                              RUN, do not walk, over to the Candlepowerforums battery sub-forum if you do not believe us.

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