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No real game changer, just the way the economics and poor government transportation policy works. Only thing that makes it possible for a USA lithium battery factory is NTSA Policy banning all air shipments of Lithium batteries. A few planes have burned up, smoke in cabins, and a couple have crashed while shipping. Really poor policy because it is one kind of lithium battery that does that; Cobalt.
Lithium Cobalt are the batteries used in Tesla Roadsters, Laptops, and Cell Phones. That is why the Roadster and to some extent the S Car and Powerwall car needs liquid cooling and thermal management.MSEE, PEComment
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Very possible our paths have crossed. MCI Worldcom use to be the largest single buyer of all Telecom equipment especially batteries and battery plants. I use to be the director of Facilities engineering until the party was over in 2003. From there started my own company doing the same work for all Telecoms and Cellular. The two biggest buyers today are the former MCIWorldcom known today as Verizon, and the other is ATT.MSEE, PEComment
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You had to do it didn't you? I call you infallible and then your very next post is so full of erroneous garbage it's hard to know where to begin.
- This is no NTSA policy banning air shipment of lithium batteries. In fact, vast quantities of lithium batteries are air shipped every day from China to USA. There are strict rules regarding the packaging of lithium batteries during air shipment, as there are for many other types of cargo.
- The Gigafactory location selection had nothing to do with government policy, other than perhaps the usual local incentives. It was driven by the need for proximity to Tesla's manufacturing in California because shipping costs for big heavy things are not immaterial.
- Tesla uses thermal management in its battery packs to extend cycle life. It has nothing to do with fire hazard, which is handled by unrelated design elements.
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But it's also a change from LA batteries to Li-on battery sub-systems. I doubt there will ever be "just batteries" sold for solar after FLA
Look at LiFoPO. I think that technology shows that civilians aren't up to the task of managing the technology. I doubt individuals need the expertise, just put the cells into a battery subsystem.Comment
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Some truth to that. Actually it is somewhat easier to charge Lithium, especially LFP. It only requires a CV/CC mode or 1 Stage aks Float. LA can be done Float charged and is exactly what Industrial and Commercial applications do.
The difference is all the dang monitoring and control required for Bottom/Mid/Top Balancing, LVD, HVSD, thermal management and liquid cooling. For experienced users just Bottom Balance and use a LVD and be done with it. Rest of the folks needs expensive complicated controls and monitoring.MSEE, PEComment
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It's still not a ban and applies to a specific type of battery on Passenger Planes.
Lithium metal batteries transportation update
Lithium metal batteries transported as cargo are restricted to Cargo Aircraft Only since 1 January 2015. The prohibition on the carriage on passenger aircraft only applies to lithium metal batteries when shipped by themselves, and does not apply to batteries packed with equipment or contained in equipment. Check the Lithium battery update for 2015 (pdf)Comment
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But isn't that just how tech happens? Take car engines. Thirty years ago you could work on your own engine, change the spark plugs, replace a belt, maybe adjust the timing a bit if you were ambitious. Nowadays with electronic ignition and engine management systems you don't want to touch the thing without a masters degree and $20k diagnostic tool. But that's what they needed to do to push out the price/performance curve. And while the NRE on these things is huge, it's just insignificant in the context of global scale manufacturing.Comment
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Tehan Lithium batteries can burst into flames, that is the main reasons some EV's use Liquid Cooling, Granted it can be used to extend battery life in mobile applications, the primary reason is safety. Tesla Roadster or anything using Colbalt is especially risky, thus why Lithium batteries have such a bad nasty reputation.
But in a home application, you are not pushing the limits of compact cramp spaces, extreme environments, and 10C discharge rates. Cobalt is also the most expensive and shortest cycle life of the family. Non eof that is a requirement in a home system, unless you cram 10 pounds of crap into a 1 pound box.
You certainly would do that in a telephone office. Nope you put them in a nice large ventilated room kept at 75 degrees for their whole life. Ask an RC pilot or RC modeler about lithium batteries? We have to charge them in special boxes or fire proof bags. They are even known to catch on fire in flight or sitting there doing nothing just like a Boeing 787. How about you laptop in the over head baggage space o o ron your belt where the cell phone is clipped on to. . .MSEE, PEComment
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A battery is no tan engine with moving parts. A very mature technology older than gasoline piston engines. The first cars were EV's before as engines were around. Edison planned to corner the market with his NiFe battery. There is no longer lasting, more expensive PIA battery than NiFe. Ask Mike. But few would ever use them.MSEE, PEComment
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Tesla updated the powerwall spec to 5kw output. Musk also said they would preferentially supply installers who sold at his low price. He said the powerwall should be installed for about $500 added to the price. Obviously this price assumes a compatible inverter.
The beginning of the end for FLA.Comment
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