Adding more panels to RV?

[Sunking]

So it's confirmed, you have no hands on experience doing RV solar whatsoever. Zero, none. .

Are you crazy or just plain stupid and cannot read?

[Wrybread]

All good points, but I think it ignores an absolutely key fact with RV solar: people learn quickly. Sure they *think* they need their microwave and electric hot plate, and come here declaring their intention of building a system that can power all that. But soon they get a sense of what sorts of loads are realistic. And then they replace that electric coffee maker with a stovetop system. No biggie and a very easy fix.

It is just like cities that feel they can run 100% of their electric equipment using only RE.

I don't think that's a good analogy because in a city people aren't likely to adjust their expectations and habits, while with an RV that's a lot easier.

So enjoy your RV and solar because it sounds like you are happy. But also know that while you and a few others can do this most will not be able to do so.

I respectfully disagree. I've met a whole lot more people who love their solar systems than hate them. In fact except for this forum I've never met anyone with decent solar and a bit of knowledge who doesn't also love it and consider it indispensable.

a lot of their hard earned money in technology that will not get them 100% of their power generation.

People need batteries whether or not they have solar, so the added expense for a good solar system is pretty small (around $400 to $600). Given that it's probably the single best upgrade you can make to an RV, I'd call that cheap.

And as far as doing routine maintenance on batteries, lets be honest, none of this stuff is rocket science. Explaining to people not to let your batteries go too low and to keep the fluid level above the fins is about as simple as it gets, and I have yet to meet anyone who couldn't wrap their head around it.

[SunEagle]

So it's confirmed, you have no hands on experience doing RV solar whatsoever. Zero, none.

Meaning you don't understand how they're used (hint: most people don't live in them full time), the tradeoffs involved, the budget priorities, mounting issues, planning factors, usage patterns, space constraints, how absolutely horrible it is to rely on a generator, and, most importantly, how beautifully solar works on an RV.

That puts a very large asterix next to all your advice in this forum. And a lot of the advice you give here, when you get away from abstract theory, is just plain wrong. My favorite quote of yours was when you said solar on an RV is "just a conversation piece, nothing more". It's no big deal that you're wrong, that itself is forgivable, and we're all here to learn. But when you spend every single day being loudly wrong about RV solar, it becomes an issue, and people who use it successfully are going to call you on it.

Earlier in this thread you told someone "One way or the other, solar cannot do what you want. It is not home and called Roughing It for a reason. Going off in a RV is all about unplugging and getting away from TV, phones, and internet. If you want all the comforts, use an RV park with electric hook ups and pull a car." As if you have any clue what you're talking about. TV, phones and internet, computers, all that stuff works beautifully in an RV with solar. It would be hilarious if you weren't so noisy with your ignorance.



I shouldn't be surprised, but yet again you're just shouting your ignorance. No grounding in reality whatsoever. You just throw as much mud as you can to see what will stick.

Anyway, not to play the Sunking game, but please cite a single thing I've said that's wrong about battery treatment. Of course you can't, since it's just more of your shot in the dark insults to distract people. My batteries almost never go below 12.2, never ever below 11.8, and they're fully charged up by solar every single week when I'm not using the RV. Hell, they're fully charged up most days even when I'm there. I have 600 watts of panels going into 4 Trojan T-105s, giving me a nice healthy charge rate. I equalize my batteries every few months and stay on top of the fluid level. My batteries are almost as clean looking as the day they were new.

And again, none of this would be any big deal, if you weren't single handedly responsible for so many people abandoning solar for their RVs based on your bad and uninformed advice. And if you're not giving bad advice in this forum you're clogging up threads with your childish bickering and shot in the dark insults.

Unfortunately the majority of the people that live in an RV do not have the understanding to keep a solar /battery system working properly. Sure there are some like you but a large number or more plug and play and will toast their batteries within the first year. This is why solar and RVing is not a good combination for everybody because they require AC, TV's, microwaves and coffee pots that consume large amounts of kWh a day.

It is just like cities that feel they can run 100% of their electric equipment using only RE. Again those that can do that are few and far between but a lot of people believe it is both easy and doable. They are not being realistic and are living in a dream world because they really do not understand the requirements of power generation and distribution.

So enjoy your RV and solar because it sounds like you are happy. But also know that while you and a few others can do this most will not be able to do so.

It is those people that I (and others like Sunking) try to give good advice and cautious planning to so they do not jump in with both feet and invest a lot of their hard earned money in technology that will not get them 100% of their power generation.

[Wrybread]

I have already covered my design and use experience. Stickies are full of RV drawings I made and built. I use those same drawing on many threads you have participated in.

So it's confirmed, you have no hands on experience doing RV solar whatsoever. Zero, none.

Meaning you don't understand how they're used (hint: most people don't live in them full time), the tradeoffs involved, the budget priorities, mounting issues, planning factors, usage patterns, space constraints, how absolutely horrible it is to rely on a generator, and, most importantly, how beautifully solar works on an RV.

That puts a very large asterix next to all your advice in this forum. And a lot of the advice you give here, when you get away from abstract theory, is just plain wrong. My favorite quote of yours was when you said solar on an RV is "just a conversation piece, nothing more". It's no big deal that you're wrong, that itself is forgivable, and we're all here to learn. But when you spend every single day being loudly wrong about RV solar, it becomes an issue, and people who use it successfully are going to call you on it.

Earlier in this thread you told someone "One way or the other, solar cannot do what you want. It is not home and called Roughing It for a reason. Going off in a RV is all about unplugging and getting away from TV, phones, and internet. If you want all the comforts, use an RV park with electric hook ups and pull a car." As if you have any clue what you're talking about. TV, phones and internet, computers, all that stuff works beautifully in an RV with solar. It would be hilarious if you weren't so noisy with your ignorance.

I know why you have gotten away with what you have done, but you do not know how badly you abuse your batteries, or why you have gotten away with it.

I shouldn't be surprised, but yet again you're just shouting your ignorance. No grounding in reality whatsoever. You just throw as much mud as you can to see what will stick.

Anyway, not to play the Sunking game, but please cite a single thing I've said that's wrong about battery treatment. Of course you can't, since it's just more of your shot in the dark insults to distract people. My batteries almost never go below 12.2, never ever below 11.8, and they're fully charged up by solar every single week when I'm not using the RV. Hell, they're fully charged up most days even when I'm there. I have 600 watts of panels going into 4 Trojan T-105s, giving me a nice healthy charge rate. I equalize my batteries every few months and stay on top of the fluid level. My batteries are almost as clean looking as the day they were new.

And again, none of this would be any big deal, if you weren't single handedly responsible for so many people abandoning solar for their RVs based on your bad and uninformed advice. And if you're not giving bad advice in this forum you're clogging up threads with your childish bickering and shot in the dark insults.

[Sunking]

Ah the battle cry of the keyboard warrior. Can I make you a tshirt that says "I play a tough guy on the internet"? I'm sure your golf buddies would be impressed.

Since I'm pretty sure you have absolutely no real world experience with solar on RVs (please cite your experience with RV solar if I'm wrong), I'm curious what your thought process is. Do you think I'm lying about not needing a generator? Or do you think I'm lying about not having one? Or are you so stuck in abstract theory that when real world experience contradicts your theory, you think it's real world experience that's got it wrong?.

Nope you have just demonstrated you do not know what you are doing. Nothing more or nothing less. I have already covered my design and use experience. Stickies are full of RV drawings I made and built. I use those same drawing on many threads you have participated in.

I know why you have gotten away with what you have done, but you do not know how badly you abuse your batteries, or why you have gotten away with it.

[Wrybread]

You might. as you are just about as dumb.

Ah the battle cry of the keyboard warrior. Can I make you a tshirt that says "I play a tough guy on the internet"? I'm sure your golf buddies would be impressed.

Since I'm pretty sure you have absolutely no real world experience with solar on RVs (please cite your experience with RV solar if I'm wrong), I'm curious what your thought process is. Do you think I'm lying about not needing a generator? Or do you think I'm lying about not having one? Or are you so stuck in abstract theory that when real world experience contradicts your theory, you think it's real world experience that's got it wrong?

Now mind you I never said no one needs a generator in their RV. If you're living full time in your RV, you might need a generator. If you really don't want to have to conserve power on those rare occasions when a multi day storm is coming, you might need a generator. If you need air conditioning even when you're boondocking, you definitely need a generator. If you insist on watching a giant screen TV for 10 hours a day, you might need a generator. If you need to run your furnace with it's 80 watt blower all day and night, you might need a generator. If you have a thing for incandescent lights, you might need a generator. But in my experience, and the experience of everyone I know with good solar on their RVs, with a few easy power consumption optimizations, I absolutely, positively do not need a generator. Never have, and never will. I didn't go below 11.8 volts all winter, and only went that low once, and it was a record setting winter for storms here in Northern California. I'll continue to tear out the gennie on every new RV I get, as I have for years. And whenever I see someone running one, it says to me that their solar systems need improvement (if they have one at all).

[Sunking]

Hi Dramaking! Bored again and looking for a fight as usual? Need a hug?

Perhaps if you are a cute bleach bottle blonde female with big (.)(.) like my wife. You might. as you are just about as dumb.

Anyway, not sure why you want to dwell on it, but no matter how petty and childish you are about it, the fact remains that I haven't needed a generator in my RV in years. Nor have most of the people I know with solar.

Then they are dumb as you after all those years and have not learned anything. Anyone with off-grid experience knows a genny is needed. After a couple of cloudy days, the batteries are exhausted and you go dark. That simple anyone can understand. Without a generator or Isolator to recharge, you set in the dark and wait for a couple of sunny days to recharge batteries. They do not charge themselves with clouds no rdo watt hours fall out of the sky

My guess is and it is along shot your batteries are large enough, and loads lite enough you can go 4 days until exhausted. Like you just admitted at most gone 4 days. Get home and park it to recharge your poor tired batteries if it was cloudy. Otherwise you are full of crap and do not know what you are talking about. Anyone living off grid for any amount of time knows they have to have a genny. There is no way around it unless you like spending a few months out of the year in the dark and replacing abused batteries every year or two. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR YOU TO DO AN EQ Charge without a genny or shore power when you get home. So don;t feed us your crap Blondie. We are not buying you a drink.

[Sunking]

We do have a 1 kW generator with our 5th wheel which has only been run for 30 minutes or so every 30 days as the manufacturer suggests.

Reed you have Lithium batteries, huge difference between Pb which must remained fully charged. Even with Lithium batteries cloudy days happen and when you have two or 3 cloudy days you are SOL when the batteries are discharged. So you either have to have a genny or go dark. Not rocket science. At least with Lithium you are not forced to fully charge as you are with Pb. Lithium works best at partial state of charge and are damage if kept fully charged like Pb. You are comparing apples and oranges.

[reed cundiff]

We do have a 1 kW generator with our 5th wheel which has only been run for 30 minutes or so every 30 days as the manufacturer suggests. We go south to Yucatan in Winter and north or to higher elevation in summer. Spent last summer in Newfoundland/Labrador. It was 103 at younger son's place in Fort Collins a few years ago and we went up to 10,400' or so and the temperature was 38 F at night and 72 C or so during the day. We are retired and have the option of going where we can achieve Goldilock life style "not to hot, not to cold, just right!" Not running a generator means wildlife is not run off and most pretty much accept our presence in a few days. Had two young Bull Moose fighting within 25 metres of 5th wheel a few years ago.
Reed and Elaine

[Wrybread]

High elevation. LFP batteries, temps in the 70's, conservation, and unlimited budget you can run AC on solar. If you know the math, the truth is in the numbers, not wild imaginations of a shadetree mechanic called Wrybread.

Hi Dramaking! Bored again and looking for a fight as usual? Need a hug?

Anyway, not sure why you want to dwell on it, but no matter how petty and childish you are about it, the fact remains that I haven't needed a generator in my RV in years. Nor have most of the people I know with solar. And I use my RV pretty much every single weekend, usually 4 days a week. But as I said I don't need air conditioning.

Maybe the reason that bothers you so much is that you're a closet generator salesman?

Personally I'd suggest gaining some real world experience with RV solar before going on about it, but I know that's not your style.

[Sunking]

Air conditioning is quite possible and simple in the mountain west. We have run the air conditioning for four hours at a time on our 34' 5th wheel and 1.5 hours at a time on Roadtrek with different solar panel setups/LFP battery banks/air conditioning units.It is another story

Reed abd Elaine

High elevation. LFP batteries, temps in the 70's, conservation, and unlimited budget you can run AC on solar. If you know the math, the truth is in the numbers, not wild imaginations of a shadetree mechanic called Wrybread.

Reed credit to you, as you kept it real by framing the conditions few can ever meet.

[reed cundiff]

@zoar: I'm getting the same vibe. If it weren't for a couple of voices of sanity here I'd give up on this forum too. I'm probably not far behind you, but because of the occasional signal among the noise I'm still hopeful. And ha look at the post above me as I type this. From someone with almost 20,000 posts!



That is so profoundly against my 20 years of having solar in RVs (and a few years living full-time off-grid in a house) it's not even funny. I'd expect it elsewhere, but on a forum dedicated to solar it's flat out amazing.

Air conditioning is quite possible and simple in the mountain west. We have run the air conditioning for four hours at a time on our 34' 5th wheel and 1.5 hours at a time on Roadtrek with different solar panel setups/LFP battery banks/air conditioning units.It is another story in the south-eastern US. We just spent 14 weeks in Mexico (Puebla, Oaxaca, Yucatan, Chiapas, Michoacan, West Coast) and only used line power in Yucatan. Since there is dirty power there, we only ran a 15 amp power line to battery charger. We have burned out air conditioners in Baja and Yucatan due to this (voltage could run 60 to 160 V). Find that running 12 W (1 amp at 12 V) portable (clamp-on) fans are sufficient at moderately warm termperatures. Australian fora are very strong on semi-split air-conditioners.

Reed abd Elaine

[SunEagle]

And hence the reality of their situation is starting to come to realization. Kauai recently installed a 13 megawatt solar install with TESLA power packs. Word from the POCO is it's cheaper than their current generation. This is no doubt and extreme situation (island with no natural resources to burn) but it's an example of how things are changing. All this "it won't work" "just get a generator" "just buy it from the POCO and don't waste your time" talk will end soon. 5-10 years and this "SOLAR" stuff will be a no-brainer. within 2 years conventional batteries will be a thing of the past. they probably already are and you just don't know it.

If you got the money to spend on your own energy storage and power generation then go for it. But most people in the US don't fall into that top 1% so they do not have the cash to do what you think is possible. Sure the POCO's can and will because they have too. That is their job to provide power 24/7/365 at whatever it takes. The problem is that the customer will eventually pay for it.

[J.P.M.]

And hence the reality of their situation is starting to come to realization. Kauai recently installed a 13 megawatt solar install with TESLA power packs. Word from the POCO is it's cheaper than their current generation. This is no doubt and extreme situation (island with no natural resources to burn) but it's an example of how things are changing. All this "it won't work" "just get a generator" "just buy it from the POCO and don't waste your time" talk will end soon. 5-10 years and this "SOLAR" stuff will be a no-brainer. within 2 years conventional batteries will be a thing of the past. they probably already are and you just don't know it.

All that may well be true. We'll see how and when true at some point in the future, hopefully sooner rather than later.

In the meantime, it may be good to keep some perspective. 13 MW is similar to spit in the ocean as far as capacity or load is concerned. Good to start small.

Also, the idea of caveat emptor as far as believing media and peddler hype are concerned might be good advice, especially given the colossal ignorance folks have about energy matters that makes them easy marks to swallow the crap of shills and conmen.

[Mike90250]

Don't forget, those tesla power packs are 20' containers, not the 5 hour battery they sell to hang on the wall.