my first attempt at home made panel

[martinjsto]

the Sylgard under the glass just after the pour need lots of weight. i was worried about the weight with the 6x6 cells but no worries, i was standing on it for a while chasing air out.

[martinjsto]

the final panel, check tomorrow and then leave alone.

[Mike90250]

Looks good, and you have a lot of the tools to make it happen

[russ]

Way to go and looks great!
Now we all wait for the week for the next installment.
Russ

[RifRaf]

that looks great, could you explain the layers at the back of the cells, are you using a second layer of glass behind the cells to stop the sylgard running away?

the glass lifting jig also looks interesting, some nifty diy, would like to know a bit more about it as well, sounds like you had good control of the glass lowering

[martinjsto]

thanks for all the support.
the main backing is that vinyl carboard stuff you see signes are made from, on top of that was thin plastic like gladwrap to stop the sylgard seeping through, on top of that was some streinghthening material, i used calico but fiberglass sheeting would be good, on top of the calico was some stiff white paper, then the cells.
all of this was sitting in a shallow alluminium frame that was the glass depth so it all snuglly fitted together.
After looking this morning i will end up with bubbles. i actualy ran out of sylgard, needed about 1/2 tub more so i ensured i spread it completly over the cells and the wires so they are coated.
the lifting jug was a bit of make it as i go. basically a inverted a frame attached to a support beam on the roof, a hole drilled through each end and a rod passed through the holes with a square end and a tap wrench as a spindle. a double pully directly above directed the lift to the end single pully that directed it dowwn to two GPS suction cups.
the ability to turn the tap wrench to lift or drop the glass was excellent.

[martinjsto]

started the new panel last night, start by soldering the tab wire to the cells, wow what a difference the correct soldering iron makes, i purchased a 58w rhino soldering station with variable temp controle, the soldering is as flat and smooth as though you have not soldered the tabbs but it is well secured to the cell. now for thee bad news.
unfortunatly i only recieved about 112ft of tabbing wire not 220ft as stated in the listing.
i purchased a kit from ebay member that has been mentioned here before, i wont mention any names yet as i am being more than patient with this seller and will give them further opportunity to fix there stuff up.
the kit arived with 28 chipped cells, some you can see in the pics, i will put up with them although these are supose to be "factory packed". there were 6 completly broken cells, no buss wire and now i find 108 ft of tabbing wire missing, what do you have to do, measure the exact lenght when it arives?

i have contacted them on the day the kit arived, they emailed me saying they will send the 6 cells and the missing bus wire on the 25th nov. then on the 1st december i recieved another email asking for a list the items i am missing so they can send it.
this is verry poor service and they dont seem to care about fixing the issue.
sorry for a whinge but i am getting really pissed with this seller.
I will be more patient and wait longer but if no responce i will publish this seller to warn others about buying from them.

[Mike90250]

Sorry to hear of your parts shortages. Be sure, if your complaint is not corrected, to let ebay & pay pal know. You may warn 1 or 2 folks here, but we can't solve the problem.

[SpaceOddacy]

I think its time to post the sellers name so that others can be weary of they're store.
Sorry to hear about the issues that really is crummy.

[RifRaf]

most solar cell 'kits' appear to have some shortfalls, this is not always the sellers fault, they pack the most minimal amount of stuff required which you can understand. in my case the amount of solder supplied was a joke, no matter as i had several rolls already, the tabbing wire supplied was lighter than what i want to use with 8Amp cells, there was not enough bus wire, only 7 diodes to make a 1000w panel array, latex gloves that did not get used, nor did i use the flux pen as the cells were pre tabbed and just had to add short connecting tabs. about 1 in 20 cells did not make the journey to the other side of the world intact in the postal system and other had small chips...

http://rifraf.dyndns.org/boat/solarkit.jpg

however, i got what i paid for, and not knowing what i needed at the time it gave me a good start, have since purchased full rolls of bus and tabbing wire of the quality i want, sourced better diodes and have learnt alot, next time i would not get a kit, because now i know what i want, but if you do get a kit, ensure you have everything you need before starting to assemble everything, its hard to calculate the amount of bus wire and tabbing wire till you have made a panel or 2.

remember this is your first panel, of course you are gonna have issues and stuffups, you are trying a more complex method of assembly as well which will need the bugs worked out of it. your next panels if you don't give up will be alot better, thats why its good to make some smaller panels first

as to the actual panels, does the corflute backing get removed after? does it worry you adding material backing to the cells that appears to be embedded with the cells, it seems to be a flammable component?

[martinjsto]

Yes RifRaf, you are correct, I am learning and have a lot to learn. i just figured if you advertise a kit with 220ft tabbing wire you should get at least within 10ft not 50%missing. I dunno, if i sell somethink i ensure it is correctly advertised and that i supply what i say i will by checking each order. this fellow only has a rating in the 200 so he isnot that big a store with thousands of customers so you would think he would look after the few he has.
anyway enough of the whinge.
i figgured the material backing will be embeded in the sylgard and therefor absorb the sylgard and become the same as far as fire risk go. I may be wrong here and will delay the next panel untill i have some fiberglass or maybe no backing.
had a look at the panel today, stood it up and gave it a test. currently
Partly Cloudy and raining
21 degrees c
Wind: S at 23 km/h
Humidity: 53%
output not loaded 15.25v need to wait for a sunny day now.
I got my hands on some security film from a friend who installs it.
its from 3m and turnes normal glass into blast proof safety glass.
i tryed a few different thicknesses and shades over a cell and found the darkest tint reduced output on a single cell from 5.5 v to 4.9v the lightest tint down to 5.2v but the opticaly clear security film made no difference 5.5v, it is rated at 88% so i guess starfire glass or low iron glass at 92% will be better but i can get the film free.
my next panel i will try the film on top of standard window glass a good alternative i think. The backing is removed now the panel is dry leaving the translucent sylgard embedded calico. im not realy happy with the finish on the back as its quite lumpy, not sure what happened, it looks like the material did not adhere to the cells well. again somethink learned.
thanks
pics of the first panel below. and yes i got a bit of air so that tecnique needs some refining, i will try your method RifRaf of laying the cells into a pool of sylgard then pourng on top. do you have a backing materia RifRaf? lor do you just use the sylgard.

[martinjsto]

i decided to remove the calico as it was not well attached. it came off quite easy with no dammage to the cells. it revealed the air issu, lots of air trapped behind cells that has moved through to the front. im not worrying about it as its my first panel.
at least the cells were painted with the sylgard prior to the final pour so they were completly covered and should be ok.
tested in the full light outside and got 21.5v at 3.54a still verry overcast no sun whatsoever and the amps vary alot as the darker clouds went over. this arfernoon should be clearer and i will test again.
I think i will use your method of encapsulation next time RifRaf,

[russ]

Doing great Martin - Learn to live and live to learn!

You have the right attitude, skills and willingness required for a somewhat complicated project - keep it up!

We appreciate your sharing with all of us all around the world!

Russ

[RifRaf]

don't get me wrong, not receiving the advertised amount of tabbing wire is not good, wonder how many actually take the time to measure the lot before using it?

the method i been using is basically the same as markp0177 from youtube, this is a new movie of the process http://www.youtube.com/user/markp017.../1/6mdBnIt0xIQ . is almost hard to get it wrong this way, and so much easier than so many of the diy methods i have seen, the ease of application saves so much work over some of the other diy methods and makes the encapsulant worth its money in that respect, plus its designed to be outdoors 20 years + , and the panels even look well made

as i use 6x6 cells i am a bit more careful, and find to cover them better thinning the sylgard out some helps alot, i don't pour first then lay the cells as you said, but rather just pour over the backs and into the cracks between cells, its amazing how far it seeps under without doing anything, so wait at least 10 minutes before trying to get bubbles out, most will work thier own way out, especially if you can afford a decent layer of sylgard, then you can squeeze out the last few bubbles by putting pressure on the backs of cells with brush while watching the cell face from underneath, you need to be able to get under the glass to see things, so my panels are normally only supported at each end during encapsulation, would be nice to have a setup like mark.

as for the backing prefer to use none, the sylgard is perfect to protect against the elements, and allows the most effective cooling of the cells and because its all clear issues can be seen, and repairs can be made if you do happen to jab a big stick or something into the back of the panel, cut out problem cells, clean, replace and add a tiny bit of sylgard to encapsulate the repair.

[martinjsto]

thanks Russ, happy to share my mistakes with you all, hehe
looked at that vid RifRaf, it looks like a good method, do you have a vibrating table?
somethng i didnt menton is that i vacuumed the sylgard befor using. i used a foodsafe vacuum system using the cannister, it certanly ensure there s no air in the mixture after you have mixed the two parts, i just vacuumed for about 5 min before the pour. what do you thin the sylgard with?