SunPower vs LG System?

[cambyses]

That sounds like an attractive deal. Curious what the monitoring system/software is like for those SP microinverter systems?

I don't know for sure, but I have heard SunPower's monitoring software is actually one of the better ones out there. They have a little web-based demo here: https://monitor.us.sunpower.com/#/dashboard

[cambyses]

I am turned off by the integrated panel and inverter item. If either the panel or inverter fails both are lost. With the LG package, if either item fails or the panel is damaged by a stone strike etc ([/B]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9oZGqLf87A) only one is lost. Secondly, if using an LG panel many other panels can replace it but with SP, likely only theirs is the replacement.

Well, "integrated" does not mean that the microinverter is somehow embedded into the panel or something. It is still a separate microinverter box and it just happens to be from the same manufacturer, installed at the factory, and warrantied by the same manufacturer. So, say, if the panel is damaged, the microinverter may still be fine, and vice versa. It is true, however, that if either the panel or the microinverter fails, I would have to call the same company (SunPower) to come and repair/replace either the panel or the mircoinverter under warranty (assuming they are still around at that time!). In regards to your second point, it may be true that mix and matching other panels with LG might be easier than SP, but I am not sure.

[bdd4]

Hello cambyses: I just self installed a 4.5KW system which consists of 14 LG320 watt panels, 14 Enphase microinverters, 1 Enpahse Envoy Communications Unit. Despite SP's higher power panels and not a significant package price difference I am turned off by the integrated panel and inverter item. If either the panel or inverter fails both are lost. With the LG package, if either item fails or the panel is damaged by a stone strike etc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9oZGqLf87A) only one is lost. Secondly, if using an LG panel many other panels can replace it but with SP, likely only theirs is the replacement.

[emartin00]

I find it interesting they are closing their Philippines plant (they dont have the tariff that the Chinese panels do) and something that the President elect said comes to mind when he was talking about Apple bringing their production back to the USA and another time said any company that closed up in the USA to Manufacture overseas would be in for a rude surprise. ...Hmmm me smells a trade war brewing and that my friends would be great news for manufactures of Solar Panels and Inverters in the States. Would probably push up prices a little but bring back manufacturing jobs.....pure wild speculation ...SP shares are up...maybe they know something.

I think you may be a bit optimistic. Cheaper panel prices are the reason solar keeps expanding. If we tax foreign panels, and cause the price to go up, demand will start to decrease. Ya, you might get a factory or 2 in the US, but the investment needed to move that kind of production to the US is massive. The Chinese companies will just continue selling to the rest of the world, and laugh at our misfortune.

[Ian S]

Yes, i.e., only about $0.21/Watt premium for SP, though I did add two more panels. So I will still end up paying more than the $29K I'd mentioned in my first post.

That sounds like an attractive deal. Curious what the monitoring system/software is like for those SP microinverter systems?

[cambyses]

That's 6.5 % over the $3.24/Watt LG price ?

Yes, i.e., only about $0.21/Watt premium for SP, though I did add two more panels. So I will still end up paying more than the $29K I'd mentioned in my first post.

[J.P.M.]

Their stock went up probably because shareholders heard that I am about to sign the contract

Thanks to solar contractors trying to book revenue before the end of the year, I managed to get a bit more discount bringing down the premium with SunPower 360W system to less than 6.5% compared to LG 320W. At that price difference, and considering better SunPower warranty, and better area efficiency on my roof (i.e., fewer number of panels for similar power), I think I will be signing the contract for the S.P. system...

Thank you again everyone for your comments on this thread...

That's 6.5 % over the $3.24/Watt LG price ?

[cambyses]

Their stock went up probably because shareholders heard that I am about to sign the contract

Thanks to solar contractors trying to book revenue before the end of the year, I managed to get a bit more discount bringing down the premium with SunPower 360W system to less than 6.5% compared to LG 320W. At that price difference, and considering better SunPower warranty, and better area efficiency on my roof (i.e., fewer number of panels for similar power), I think I will be signing the contract for the S.P. system...

Thank you again everyone for your comments on this thread...

[SunEagle]

I find it interesting they are closing their Philippines plant (they dont have the tariff that the Chinese panels do) and something that the President elect said comes to mind when he was talking about Apple bringing their production back to the USA and another time said any company that closed up in the USA to Manufacture overseas would be in for a rude surprise. ...Hmmm me smells a trade war brewing and that my friends would be great news for manufactures of Solar Panels and Inverters in the States. Would probably push up prices a little but bring back manufacturing jobs.....pure wild speculation ...SP shares are up...maybe they know something.

That could be the plan. It would be nice to see more US manufactures.

Their stock price probably went up because they shed some overheard & expenses so maybe they look more financially attractive.

[solar pete]

I find it interesting they are closing their Philippines plant (they dont have the tariff that the Chinese panels do) and something that the President elect said comes to mind when he was talking about Apple bringing their production back to the USA and another time said any company that closed up in the USA to Manufacture overseas would be in for a rude surprise. ...Hmmm me smells a trade war brewing and that my friends would be great news for manufactures of Solar Panels and Inverters in the States. Would probably push up prices a little but bring back manufacturing jobs.....pure wild speculation ...SP shares are up...maybe they know something.

[SunEagle]

Maybe both. It seems the price gap has narrowed: the O.P.'s quotes show SP at only $3.66 per watt vs $3.24 for the LG. Or maybe prices really have dropped that much. Can SP survive? Can anyone survive? If LG or any other conglomerate for that matter wanted to they could jettison their solar business in a heartbeat. Will Total have more patience with SP? Who really knows?

I agree. Hard to forecast anything concerning solar pv companies. Hopefully things will get better and more stable.

[Ian S]

Not sure if SP's panels cost more because of the N type or because they feel they can just get away with the higher price.

Maybe both. It seems the price gap has narrowed: the O.P.'s quotes show SP at only $3.66 per watt vs $3.24 for the LG. Or maybe prices really have dropped that much. Can SP survive? Can anyone survive? If LG or any other conglomerate for that matter wanted to they could jettison their solar business in a heartbeat. Will Total have more patience with SP? Who really knows?

[SunEagle]

The more costly N-type silicon technology used by SP is what gives them their resistance to light degradation. Other manufacturers are moving to N-type away from P-type silicon which exhibits the LID due to the reaction of traces of Boron with oxygen. N-type silicon has no boron. It also has some other advantages and in the future, SP will have more competition as others switch to that technology.

As long as it doesn't raise the cost of the final product.

Not sure if SP's panels cost more because of the N type or because they feel they can just get away with the higher price. Unfortunately it looks like the lack of sales has hurt the company even if it does have a better mousetrap.

[Ian S]

As for S.P. and their warranty, first off, a lot can happen in the first 6 months after mfg. Then, item 2a of the published warranty and the S.P. definition of minimum peak power contained therein would seem to me go a long way to covering their butts for any light induced (burn in) degradation.

The more costly N-type silicon technology used by SP is what gives them their resistance to light degradation. Other manufacturers are moving to N-type away from P-type silicon which exhibits the LID due to the reaction of traces of Boron with oxygen. N-type silicon has no boron. It also has some other advantages and in the future, SP will have more competition as others switch to that technology.

[miracj]

I would be hesitant to go with SunPower based on some of what I see in the news about them shedding 1/4 of their staff and cutting costs.

Well that certainly doesn't bode well for them. There are always losers in any competitive industry, so one need to weigh carefully the viability of the company. I look forward to a future where all the parts from all companies are built to the same standards, so that the parts become interchangeable. Whether that ever could happen, I doubt it, but it would either be led by a maverick leader like Tesla or government regulation if it did.