22.3KW Self install complete, $1.25/W!

[JFinch57]

I wouldn't (and didn't)

If everything works - great.
If there's a problem - how do you deal with warranty issues?
Why is it being sold on e-bay? Is it refurbished? Other issues?

For me the risk wasn't worth the reward.

Enphase uses the date the inverter first reports for the warranty start. There are many reputable sellers on eBay, and the panels are also warrantied by the manufacturer. I bought panels from the same guy 3 times, and it's a real solar company. The Square D 200A outdoor 40 slot load center normally goes for over $600, and I got it for less than $200. Do the math, if it fails and the manufacturer won't honor the warranty then buy another one, you're still way ahead of the game!

[foo1bar]

Thank you for the info. I just thought Ebay is not the place to buy Solar equipment. It seems I am wrong.

I wouldn't (and didn't)

If everything works - great.
If there's a problem - how do you deal with warranty issues?
Why is it being sold on e-bay? Is it refurbished? Other issues?

For me the risk wasn't worth the reward.

[solarz]

Thank you for the info. I just thought Ebay is not the place to buy Solar equipment. It seems I am wrong.

[JFinch57]

So before rebates and credits, $41k for 22.3kw or $1.85/W
Congratulations.
That's better than I did on a pre-tax/pre-rebate basis.

Are you willing to share what you spent on materials, labor, services, etc?
It probably would be educational to other people contemplating a DIY.

Ground mount system on first page, Phase II roof system 36 X 260W + 10 X 255W (all mono panels) = 11.91KW:

Solar Panels $9,563.50
Electrical Panel/Wire $1,298.22
Roof Mounts $2,695.96
MicroInverters $6,140.00 (Enphase M-250)
Permits ~$120.00

Total before tax credit $19,817.68
Tax Credit (30%) -$5,945.30
Total Cost $13,872.38

Breakown:

Electrical Panel/Wire/Misc
$36.43 Wire-Ebay
$40.99 Wire-Ebay
$150.00 Wire/Boxes-Home Depot
$100.00 Conduit/Misc
$37.91 Enphase Brackets
$720.00 Enphase Cables-36
$212.89 Enphase Cables-10

Roof Mounting/Trench
$75.00 Fazzio/Stainless Hdw.
$1,693.22 Allied-Unirac
55.65 Allied-Inverter T bolt
68.09 Allied-Add clamps
$600.00 Trench Excavation (includes driveway lights)
$160.00 Ditch Witch Rental
$44.00 Enphase Cable Clips

The price also included adding a 200A dedicated solar "pre-main" tap to my 400A service, included with the ground mount system. Total roof & ground ~$41,700 pre-tax for 22.7KW = $1.84/W.

[JFinch57]

You buy panel and inverter on Ebay also?

Yes, I bought the inverters, panels, Enphase cables, Enphase Envoy, 200A outdoor load center, outdoor meter pan/200A breaker, indoor 200A main breaker, WEEBS, and even some of the #10 TWNW on Ebay. Got open spools of THWN with ~400' left for about $35 delivered.

[solarz]

You buy panel and inverter on Ebay also?

[JFinch57]

Ground mount 10.8KW, 45 panels:

Solar Panels $8,474.80
Electrical Panel/Wire $2,521.68
Ground Mounts $7,553.52
MicroInverters $3,179.90
Permits $120.00

Total before tax credit $21,849.90
Tax Credit (30%) -$6,554.97
State Grant -$1,000.00
Total Cost $14,294.93

Breakdown Ground Mounts:
$1,501.49 Fazzio (pipe/misc)
$4,413.38 Allied (Unirac)
$115.80 WEEBs
$673.50 Cement
$400.00 Drill holes (subcontracted)
$40.00 N-S Alignment (bought a compass!)
$210.55 Home Depot
$91.80 Cement Buggy Rental
$107.00 Bandsaw Blades

Breakdown on Elec Panel/Wiring:
$91.00 Meter/Main
$70.10 Enphase Harnesses
$400.00 Conduit/Misc
$186.00 Outdoor Load Center
$52.35 Main Breaker
$98.84 Main Breaker Panel
$1,183.40 United Electric
$390.00 Envoy
$49.99 Terminal Lug Kit

Most items bought on Ebay!

I have to figure out the roof system, might take a few days.

[foo1bar]

Total cost for ground & roof panels after $1K state grant and 30% federal tax credit ~ $28K/22.3KW= $1.25/W.

So before rebates and credits, $41k for 22.3kw or $1.85/W
Congratulations.
That's better than I did on a pre-tax/pre-rebate basis.

Are you willing to share what you spent on materials, labor, services, etc?
It probably would be educational to other people contemplating a DIY.

[bcroe]

Bruce, when I say the ground panels didn't do bad it is probably ~60% of summer, but they did clip with the Enphase M190s. I use a window washing brush/squeegee on a long telescoping pole to take the snow off and had to do it 2-3X last year. Wasn't that bad to do except my hands practically froze even with North commercial "Polar" gloves on (damn polar vortex!). I can only monitor one of the geothermal units for resistance heating and it was minimal. Have a 4 ton Waterfurnace Series 7 and a 5 ton Waterfurnace Envision. The Series 7 is amazing, and purchased it 1 year later. What a difference in technology between the two units. I like 480v fred but the last panels delivered 5 weeks ago have 8/10 DOA. He's working with me to repair/replace, thinks the lead boxes are bad since I have good voltage from the panel but only 1V coming out. Somebody dropped the ball, rounded up a bunch of panels put aside in the corner! I know he'll make it right. Jeff

Last winter wasn't too bad here; the winter before I was out clearing snow a dozen and a half times, over
the walkways and drives on these 5 acres, and the PV panels. I use a pair of hand warmers (HotHands)
to keep my hands comfortable for a couple hours. These are claimed to work for 12 hours, seemed like
a waste. So after use I put them in a very small, air tight container to stop the reaction, and I am able
to use them a couple more times.

The technology of variable speed AC motors is changing a lot of processes, but it always involves making
DC to supply the variable frequency inverter. On my future project list is to get a mini split heat pump,
and see if I can use some panels to supply much of that DC. No PoCo permit required, but they will be
making up any shortfall. The car shop has room for a lot of panels on the metal walls, and I would have
the mini split run anytime appreciable sun is available, trying to always keep the interior above freezing.
I blast it up to 60F with propane for serious work.

Fred has some kind of EE credentials, but I'm not convinced he understands PV panels on the level we
do here. Certainly no test facilities, last time I visited. But we have done good business. Bruce Roe

[JFinch57]

Bruce, when I say the ground panels didn't do bad it is probably ~60% of summer, but they did clip with the Enphase M190s. I use a window washing brush/squeegee on a long telescoping pole to take the snow off and had to do it 2-3X last year. Wasn't that bad to do except my hands practically froze even with North commercial "Polar" gloves on (damn polar vortex!). I can only monitor one of the geothermal units for resistance heating and it was minimal. Have a 4 ton Waterfurnace Series 7 and a 5 ton Waterfurnace Envision. The Series 7 is amazing, and purchased it 1 year later. What a difference in technology between the two units. I like 480v fred but the last panels delivered 5 weeks ago have 8/10 DOA. He's working with me to repair/replace, thinks the lead boxes are bad since I have good voltage from the panel but only 1V coming out. Somebody dropped the ball, rounded up a bunch of panels put aside in the corner! I know he'll make it right. Jeff

[bcroe]

Bruce, The ground mount is at 30 degrees and didn't do too bad last winter. There are large evergreens not in the picture to the left. My wife is anti tree removal and topping, but I'm slowly working on that. I've trimmed the maple tree back a bit. I'm getting a travel lift to paint the back side of the house in the spring, and that will also work great for pruning! It's the roof mount that won't do well in the winter at 14 degrees and behind the trees and to the right. I'm hoping to put at lease 4 of my extra 6 panels hinged to the bottom of the ground array to adjust for better summer/winter production. Summer production should be great.

When they installed the geothermal I put the feed pipe in the same trench which made installation much easier. The roof feeds back to the ground array where there's a dedicated 200A outdoor Square D QO panel and the production meter (3/0 copper line side, #4 neutral, will handle 38KW of AC). I have enough wire in the conduit to add another 24 panels on the roof, one pair capped off and 8 available on one of the strings.

For the ground mount I had one friend help me build the frame and 2 friends help with the concrete work. After that it's just me with a little help from my wife to pull the wire, and same for the roof.

The Enphase public site is here, did 65KWh today! Two panels are defective and 480Vfred (from "you know where") is getting me new connection blocks for them. https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/...48852/overview

Yes, the price includes everything. I had 10 Enphase M-190s left over from NJ and bought 35 more for around $90 each. Got the 46 M-250s on Ebay for $130 ea plus shipping. The M250 first 36 cable drops were $15 ea and the last 10 $22 ea. Used all Unirac mounting for both.

My panels are elevated 25 degrees, which seemed OK for summer and was very convenient
for erection. Today I could see it was just too low for this time of year. Despite being over
paneled, the string inverters were shy of clipping. Add the low sun angle shooting through
more dust, marginal panel elevation, and the short day, production was about 57% of a sunny
summer day.

Do you push the snow off the ground mount? I was not willing to give up any energy
at first. But I have started putting big gaps between panels so the snow can drop through.

I'm the only one who regularly gets back to the array, so operations aren't much inhibited.
You can trim trees, but its amazing how fast they try to get back to the old elevation. And
pruning a big tree can be dangerous; in the air you can't just step back when things start
to fall. The real fix is just remove them.

Not sure yet if a big geothermal and smaller solar would have saved me much, but what
I'm doing is working for now. Can't make it through a really cold winter without any
resistance heating.

My "turnkey" south facing array was built up from standard extruded aluminum. After
the first test fitting of components, I ended up drilling nearly a thousand missing or
misplaced holes in my shop and erecting all of it. The E-W was very little cost from
treated wood and a minimum of aluminum, erected solely by me in just one month.

If I had that size wire, power delivered would pick up 2% or more. But I elected to use
the wire already buried here. I have dozens of panels from 480Vfred, 2 dead and 2
poor producers. He eventually replaced those 4; prices were good. Some "cosmetic
defects" had no mounting holes, but I do have a drill. 40 are currently serving well.
Bruce Roe

[JFinch57]

Bruce, The ground mount is at 30 degrees and didn't do too bad last winter. There are large evergreens not in the picture to the left. My wife is anti tree removal and topping, but I'm slowly working on that. I've trimmed the maple tree back a bit. I'm getting a travel lift to paint the back side of the house in the spring, and that will also work great for pruning! It's the roof mount that won't do well in the winter at 14 degrees and behind the trees and to the right. I'm hoping to put at lease 4 of my extra 6 panels hinged to the bottom of the ground array to adjust for better summer/winter production. Summer production should be great.

When they installed the geothermal I put the feed pipe in the same trench which made installation much easier. The roof feeds back to the ground array where there's a dedicated 200A outdoor Square D QO panel and the production meter (3/0 copper line side, #4 neutral, will handle 38KW of AC). I have enough wire in the conduit to add another 24 panels on the roof, one pair capped off and 8 available on one of the strings.

For the ground mount I had one friend help me build the frame and 2 friends help with the concrete work. After that it's just me with a little help from my wife to pull the wire, and same for the roof.

The Enphase public site is here, did 65KWh today! Two panels are defective and 480Vfred (from "you know where") is getting me new connection blocks for them. https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/...48852/overview

Yes, the price includes everything. I had 10 Enphase M-190s left over from NJ and bought 35 more for around $90 each. Got the 46 M-250s on Ebay for $130 ea plus shipping. The M250 first 36 cable drops were $15 ea and the last 10 $22 ea. Used all Unirac mounting for both.

[bcroe]

Total cost for ground & roof panels after $1K state grant and 30% federal tax credit ~ $28K/22.3KW= $1.25/W. The price and KW includes 6 additional panels that I will be adding to the ground array. Picture of Phase II roof panels just completed

Phase I ground array completed June 2014. I have trimmed the maple tree on the right since the picture was taken

Very nice, and economical; does that price include inverters? I suppose you couldn't get the
ground mount any farther from those trees? Mine are in my largest clearing, but the clearing
has been gradually getting bigger.

My eyeball says the angle of the ground mount elevation angle is too low for good winter
production; are you mostly relying on summer KWHs? Its going to be tough to generate
42,000 KWH a year where there are clouds & snow. Bruce Roe

[JFinch57]

Is it safe to assume you'll never have to pay for power?

Getting there, house is 100% electric, has 9 tons of geothermal and is 6,500 sq. ft. Our use averages ~3,500 KWh/month so we're about 2/3. I'm loosing about 50% on the roof in the winter months due to shading. My wife doesn't want to know about topping trees, which we did in our last house and she says it's ugly. Still working on that! A good percentage goes to heating the lower level to keep my mother in law warm.

[8.4]

Is it safe to assume you'll never have to pay for power?