Northwest Ohio, I need help designing system

[gary c]

With 17k of panels we have good generation even on cloudy days. 20-30% still gets the batteries up to 100% in 7 hrs or by the end of the day. Where we are falling short is with long nights needing 15 hrs of battery use we are under batteried. We have 4 EG4s and kick to the grid at about 3 in the morning. 2 more batteries would get us through comfortably. Of course there are those Northwest Ohio days of 1000 ft, 100% cloud cover where we would have to run a generator, if we weren't grid collected. But that would have only been for a couple of times for 3-4 hrs.

[Rade]

Well, it sounds like you local energy CoOp really has your hands tied. Would you be able to install, say, as private wind turbine to augment the solar? It might be enough to generate sustaining and charging power during the low sun seasons. Just a thought. I see them on the farms all around Westport MA, used to keep the heaters and lights on around the properties.

[gary c]

As a follow up to my post asking for help. We have 32 540 watt bifacial panels ground mount. Sol-ark 15 and 4 EG4 batteries. I have things set so the sol-ark uses panels, then batteries , then the grid. No grid feedback. Been running since Aug 8th. Thru Oct we were 100% solar. In Nov and so far in Dec. we had kicked to the grid 3 times. Northwest Ohio is often really cloudy. With 17Kwh of panel we get enough generation on all but the cloudiest days. I talking 100% cloud cover with a cloud ceiling of 1000 ft for several days in a row.. It has worked without a hitch. We will stay on the grid for now but could have done just fine with generator backup so far. I'm getting lazy since I turned 70.

[J.P.M.]

I admit having the panels first was a backward approach. Long story, but that is where I am at. Is it a good idea to avail myself of the design capabilities of various suppliers to get ideas?

IMO only, no. At least not without more knowledge of how things work.
Reads like you did the "Ready, Fire, Aim" thing.
If you want a safe, well engineered and cost effective system that's serviceable, don't avail yourself of anything more than your own ability to educate yourself to the point where you dig yourself out of the knowledge hole you're in and can understand everything any vendor is proposing from start to finish.
Consumer ignorance is a peddler's nirvana.
Start your education with a read of "Solar Power Your Home for Dummies", a free online PDF. A bit dated, but lots of basic stuff you'll need to know.

[gary c]

I admit having the panels first was a backward approach. Long story, but that is where I am at. Is it a good idea to avail myself of the design capabilities of various suppliers to get ideas?

[Mike 134]

Thanks for all the opinion. Does anyone have any helpful information or suggestions

From your first post "I have 34 540 watt bifacial panels , ground mounted."

Now you're looking for information?

[SunEagle]

Thanks for all the opinion. Does anyone have any helpful information or suggestions

I am just trying to help you not waste your money. Going off grid is very expensive and will require a lot more of your time to watch and maintain your system. A grid tied solar pv system will still be cheaper and more reliant in the long run regardless of who your POCO is.

[J.P.M.]

Thanks for all the opinion. Does anyone have any helpful information or suggestions

You're most welcome.
Yes. A respectful suggestion: Learn more about solar energy and its limitations before you go further. Reads to me like you don't know what you don't know.
Take what you want of the above. Scrap the rest.

[gary c]

Thanks for all the opinion. Does anyone have any helpful information or suggestions

[SunEagle]

That much off grid design will make things about as expensive as an entirely off grid system not only in $ cost but in maintenance and reliability. It is what it is.

I agree with you. Having a system like that is not cheap and IMO is still more expensive then having a total connection to the POCO.

[J.P.M.]

I started out to go the net metering route. The local utility trades even for generation that is used while generating. Any excess during the day they pay wholesale for and what you use at night you pay retail for. There is no banking of excess generation. I ended up working a great deal on panels and racking and decided to see if I could generate enough to now have to mess with the utility. Yes net metering would be nice but I also wanted to have power when the grid went down so was looking at hybrid inverters until I was informed that since I was going t o generate too much power the utility would no longer let me be a customer but I'd have to go with their supplier. I want to use them as back up only. It is what it is. I have a great resource and am looking for advice on how to most efficiently use it. I am looking for product recommendations.

That much off grid design will make things about as expensive as an entirely off grid system not only in $ cost but in maintenance and reliability. It is what it is.

[gary c]

I started out to go the net metering route. The local utility trades even for generation that is used while generating. Any excess during the day they pay wholesale for and what you use at night you pay retail for. There is no banking of excess generation. I ended up working a great deal on panels and racking and decided to see if I could generate enough to now have to mess with the utility. Yes net metering would be nice but I also wanted to have power when the grid went down so was looking at hybrid inverters until I was informed that since I was going t o generate too much power the utility would no longer let me be a customer but I'd have to go with their supplier. I want to use them as back up only. It is what it is. I have a great resource and am looking for advice on how to most efficiently use it. I am looking for product recommendations.

[bcroe]

In order to have generation to supply my winter needs I will end up producing about 174% of my annual usage. Gary.

That is about the way it works. I might collect 3000 KWh in a summer
month, 1000 KWh in a winter month. A pretty innefficient use of
resources. Fortunately Net Metering here cures that loss, at no cost
to me. Bruce Roe

[J.P.M.]

What are your reasons for all the PV ?
Is economic benefit one of them ? If so, my guess is you're looking at a long payback/low ROI.
Such a system as you anticipate will probably generate something like 25,000 kWh/yr. with a 45 deg. tilt.
All that said, if you haven't done so already, do a few PVWatts runs with the goal of maximizing winter output.
I'd suggest you consider a vertical array, with a mostly south facing orientation as that seems to maximize winter output in NW Ohio. such an orientation produces an annual output of something like 950 - 975 kWh/yr. per STC kW, with about half of that production coming in the Nov. - Mar. period.
With the vertical orientation, you might just also get some benefit from a bifacial panel.

Vertical orientation will also keep the array mostly snow free as long as you keep the arrays high enough off the ground to avoid snow buildup. Just don't forget about drifts buildup in front of the array.
Depending on your winter loads, which it seems will set the system size, I think you might want to bone up on string inverter sizing as f(array size). With a grossly undersized inverter as your numbers show, you'll get some serious clipping.

But after all that, and given your POCO's stance on PV, I'd wonder about the practical and financial viability of the project.

[organic farmer]

I heat with wood, most homes in my township do.

We use a cheap [less than $300] woodstove that heats circulating water, which circulates to a thermal-bank, which then circulates through our radiant flooring. We have a solar thermal array all setup, but I over-pressurized it and caused a lot of internal damage. Overall it is designed so we can easily shift from using wood as fuel or using solar as fuel. In both cases the heat sources are rated at 3X more than how much heat we need for living in Maine. I just need to get motivated to spend a summer repairing these solar thermal panels.