How long with a T105 battery last if its never used?

[Murby]

Just buy a gun and a bullet. Shoot yourself when SHTF. You are going to die anyway. Why suffer?

Well by that logic, you should just shoot yourself when you're old enough to buy a gun because you're going to die anyway?????? Doesn't make a lot of sense. Others might want to go that route.. I'm not judging.. but not me.. I will survive and flourish.

No battery is going to make it that long.

Sure you don't want to reconsider that statement? You don't think a battery can last 5 years??? Almost any battery will last 5 years..

Just where are you going to get distilled water from?

I won't need distilled water... I will be filling my lead acid batteries with Dihydrogen Monoxide.

http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html

I have the patent information for the machinery and the secrete formula for a top secret process to make this stuff...and I have purchased the complex equipment for that purpose.

When SHTF, me and my friends will see your solar panels and kill you for them. Just shoot yourself and save yourself the misery.

By the time you got close enough to see my panels, you'll already be dog food and garden fertilizer..... good luck with that.

[bcroe]

Another pack rat at this house has loaded it with food and drink. That is about the only thing here
that MIGHT help briefly for SHTF. Bruce Roe

[SunEagle]

Not as ignorant as not reading the whole thread to understand what we're talking about...

Your car depends on infrastructure to keep running.... Solar panels do not. Once you have them, they will generate energy for decades. Your car, or a generator, require infrastructure to keep them fueled.. Solar panels do not..

Batteries require infrastructure to keep them charged.. the solar panels are the infrastructure.. you could put them on a raft in the middle of the ocean and they'd make power for decades without any need for extra infrastructure..
Put a generator on a raft and it will stop working as soon as it runs out of fuel. Over the course of time spans measured in decades, solar panels will produce many times more energy than you could possibly store in the form of gasoline or diesel.. well.. at least at any level of practicality..

Remember if the SHTF then there will be no police or protection from the roving mobs. Those solar panels will draw thieves to them like ants to a picnic. If you want to survive you better think of ways to do it without electricity or for that matter the internet, computers, tv, radio, cell phones, etc will be pretty much useless.

[J.P.M.]

Not as ignorant as not reading the whole thread to understand what we're talking about...

Your car depends on infrastructure to keep running.... Solar panels do not. Once you have them, they will generate energy for decades. Your car, or a generator, require infrastructure to keep them fueled.. Solar panels do not..

Batteries require infrastructure to keep them charged.. the solar panels are the infrastructure.. you could put them on a raft in the middle of the ocean and they'd make power for decades without any need for extra infrastructure..
Put a generator on a raft and it will stop working as soon as it runs out of fuel. Over the course of time spans measured in decades, solar panels will produce many times more energy than you could possibly store in the form of gasoline or diesel.. well.. at least at any level of practicality..

Put a battery on a raft and try to get another one when it dies and there's no infrastructure to replace it. Everything needs infrastructure. Time frame before infrastructure support is needed seems to be a definitional point, perhaps as some f(maint. requirements). Lead door stops, book ends, boat anchors and such like probably don't need much ongoing infrastructure support. PV components beyond panels will need some maintenance during an ownership cycle, with battery replacement sooner than later.

[Sunking]

Just buy a gun and a bullet. Shoot yourself when SHTF. You are going to die anyway. Why suffer? No battery is going to make it that long. Just where are you going to get distilled water from? When SHTF, me and my friends will see your solar panels and kill you for them. Just shoot yourself and save yourself the misery.

[SunEagle]

Yes.. SHTF.. I anticipate the grid going down for two to five years.. When it comes back up, power will be rationed to just a couple hours a day for the next year or two.. then it will be on for a few more hours per day as things get rebuilt. Full power restored within five to ten years.

So I need to be set up to survive the first three to five years or so.... after that, other alternatives can be created. I'm building a home made wood gassifier to be able to run a small generator if needed, but main power should come from the solar panels since they have an extremely long lifespan.

I don't know your age or health situation but with the grid going down for 5 years I would say there will be a very high number of deaths (probably mine included) that will happen.

Besides the lack of refrigerated food, without power there will be no medicine made or medical equipment in doctors offices or hospitals that could run. That would severely limit health care back to the practices found before Edison was around.

If you feel you want to survive the decade waiting for full power to be restored then have at it and good luck.

[Murby]

That is just plain ignorant. Solar depends heavily on infrastructure. Batteries and solar are a complete waste of all resources. Batteries have negative EROI.

Not as ignorant as not reading the whole thread to understand what we're talking about...

Your car depends on infrastructure to keep running.... Solar panels do not. Once you have them, they will generate energy for decades. Your car, or a generator, require infrastructure to keep them fueled.. Solar panels do not..

Batteries require infrastructure to keep them charged.. the solar panels are the infrastructure.. you could put them on a raft in the middle of the ocean and they'd make power for decades without any need for extra infrastructure..
Put a generator on a raft and it will stop working as soon as it runs out of fuel. Over the course of time spans measured in decades, solar panels will produce many times more energy than you could possibly store in the form of gasoline or diesel.. well.. at least at any level of practicality..

[Murby]

I think OP keeps referring to SHTF situation when no infrastructure will be available. IMO at that point electricity as a concept will be gone too and whoever survives will have to start from scratch. You can get by for 2-5 years with everything gone but then things will start to break and there won't be replacements available. Nature will take over so most useful items will be firearms and ammo and even them will be gone too in 50 years or so. The data storage as we know it today won't last long so the books kept in oxygen free enclosure would probably be the best source of info.

Yes.. SHTF.. I anticipate the grid going down for two to five years.. When it comes back up, power will be rationed to just a couple hours a day for the next year or two.. then it will be on for a few more hours per day as things get rebuilt. Full power restored within five to ten years.

So I need to be set up to survive the first three to five years or so.... after that, other alternatives can be created. I'm building a home made wood gassifier to be able to run a small generator if needed, but main power should come from the solar panels since they have an extremely long lifespan.

[Sunking]

Generators are not a renewable source of energy.. Since they depend on infrastructure to provide them with fuel, they are not a consideration for a long term solution.

That is just plain ignorant. Solar depends heavily on infrastructure. Batteries and solar are a complete waste of all resources. Batteries have negative EROI.

[SunEagle]

Generators are not a renewable source of energy.. Since they depend on infrastructure to provide them with fuel, they are not a consideration for a long term solution.

My opinion is that batteries have a shorter life span then any type of fossil fuel generator. But then again your opinion may be different.

Since the 2004 hurricane season I have never run out of gasoline or propane during any power outage in my area of Florida.

[max2k]

Define long term.

Off grid relies on infrastructure as well. Think batteries and the infrastructure required to make, maintain and dispose of them. It's all relative.

I think OP keeps referring to SHTF situation when no infrastructure will be available. IMO at that point electricity as a concept will be gone too and whoever survives will have to start from scratch. You can get by for 2-5 years with everything gone but then things will start to break and there won't be replacements available. Nature will take over so most useful items will be firearms and ammo and even them will be gone too in 50 years or so. The data storage as we know it today won't last long so the books kept in oxygen free enclosure would probably be the best source of info.

[J.P.M.]

Generators are not a renewable source of energy.. Since they depend on infrastructure to provide them with fuel, they are not a consideration for a long term solution.

Define long term.

Off grid relies on infrastructure as well. Think batteries and the infrastructure required to make, maintain and dispose of them. It's all relative.

[Murby]

Generators are not a renewable source of energy.. Since they depend on infrastructure to provide them with fuel, they are not a consideration for a long term solution.

[Mike90250]

A small generator can charge a small battery bank for quiet night time illumination. Might be able to run a fridge off it too, just spend more $ for more batteries , but much less than a field of solar PV panels.

[SunEagle]

I have a 5000 watt portable generator that I converted to run on our natural gas.. We're out in a semi-rural area surrounded by farmland and 5 to 10 acre plots.. A lot of times, when the power goes out, its only for three or four hours.. (this is what I'm trying to look for a solution for).. When a big storm hits, we know the power is going to be out for days and I just pull out the 5000 watt unit and run it continuously on natural gas for days on end. I do shut it off at night however and it would be really cool to have a battery backup system to keep the sump pump running and maybe charge phones and stuff..
A small portable generator might be an idea to consider.. have to find something really quiet because I don't want to hear it when I'm trying to sleep.

There are a couple of inverter type generators that are relatively quiet and can be enclosed to reduce the noise even more. Sure a battery supplying power to critical loads at night is nice but at what cost?

Is it worth spending a lot of money on a solar / battery system for emergency power or finding a way to get a lot more power quietly by using small generators?