Moderation in all things baby, and moderation is the first to go!

[Hirox]

Thanks for giving us some back ground on yourself.

Just try to be aware the like in life, there are a lot of people in here that have different opinions. Especially concerning people and solar technology that claim their device is the "holy grail" and needs to be purchased when most times it is not.

While I have my opinion of Tesla and Musk, IMO his "power all" home battery is more hype than meat but I have hopes it will change for the better sometime down the road.

Which is why I didn't mention it. I just wanted to point out that "russ" should stick to topics he knows, SpaceX is not one of them.

--Mod note: I do not know of a way to insert a new post at the beginning of a thread, so I am borrowing this space from Living Large. This post and the immediately following posts come from the large Tesla thread, where the personal attack level has started rising.
This new thread would be, IMHO, a good place to discuss what members think should our should not be done in terms of Forum policies and Moderator actions.
In any case, the final word will be that of the Forum owners.
I am placing a redirect to this thread in the Tesla thread.

[Living Large]

I would also like to remind you that we are in the "solar energy technology" section so please keep on topic.

I'd like to point out that Russ is a moderator, so I am confident that he is aware of his surroundings. This was pretty funny though.

Which is why I didn't mention it. I just wanted to point out that "russ" should stick to topics he knows.

Is this a new requirement?

[inetdog]

OK, here is a draft (just from me) policy statement on the Forum. Others may have a different understanding, and just FYI Russ has not been around for more than a month.

1. In a technical topic area, digressions from purely technical matters into policy and political questions may still be appropriate as long as they are put forward in a way that does not constitute a personal attack or trolling. The moderators will jump in to suppress things that go clearly beyond the pale.
2. In the General Discussion topic there is no need for any technical connection to solar energy at all, although posts in the solar energy realm that do not seem to fit another topic are certainly welcome. The restrictions about politics and religion (including secular humanism ) will be less strictly enforced there but the rules on personal attacks will be in full force.

Note that one man's free speech is another man's trolling, so the Moderators do not have a simple job. I personally will tend to lean toward the free speech side. Until I get fed up, of course.

[solar pete]

OK, here is a draft (just from me) policy statement on the Forum. Others may have a different understanding, and just FYI Russ has not been around for more than a month.

1. In a technical topic area, digressions from purely technical matters into policy and political questions may still be appropriate as long as they are put forward in a way that does not constitute a personal attack or trolling. The moderators will jump in to suppress things that go clearly beyond the pale.
2. In the General Discussion topic there is no need for any technical connection to solar energy at all, although posts in the solar energy realm that do not seem to fit another topic are certainly welcome. The restrictions about politics and religion (including secular humanism ) will be less strictly enforced there but the rules on personal attacks will be in full force.

Note that one man's free speech is another man's trolling, so the Moderators do not have a simple job. I personally will tend to lean toward the free speech side. Until I get fed up, of course.

That sounds fair to me. +1

[inetdog]

PS: Compared to many other forums, Solar Panel Talk seems a little light on formal policies.
With the exception of section 10.2 at http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/faq.ph...q_terms_of_use, there is not really much about content. Most of the verbiage there is boilerplate/generic to keep the lawyers happy and to protect Solar Reviews.
I am perfectly happy to continue with "unwritten" policies, but would also be willing to help formalize them if there is enough interest in that.

[pleppik]

PS: Compared to many other forums, Solar Panel Talk seems a little light on formal policies.
With the exception of section 10.2 at http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/faq.ph...q_terms_of_use, there is not really much about content. Most of the verbiage there is boilerplate/generic to keep the lawyers happy and to protect Solar Reviews.
I am perfectly happy to continue with "unwritten" policies, but would also be willing to help formalize them if there is enough interest in that.

Moderating an online forum is a hard job, and formal policies are only part of the answer.

Of course there should be a general policy against harassment, stalking, threats, "doxxing," and similar boorish behavior.

But in addition to all that, the Moderator's role is really to maintain the discussion so the community can be the kind of community it wants to be. Like a gardener, the job involves some combination of planting, pruning, and weeding.

There are as many different community standards as there are communities, but the risk in being too proscriptive and rule-bound is that the worst trolls positively revel in exploiting the loopholes. It's behavior any parent will be familiar with, and fortunately most people outgrow it by age three or four...

So personally, I would rather see a general statement of what kind of discussions we're trying to foster combined with moderators who share the same vision and have some discretion to promote that direction.

And props for working to promote this forum. You at least convinced me to come back and lurk for a while if nothing else.

[J.P.M.]

Tough call, and in any case not mine, but maybe a good start. There are probably no 100% correct answers. I'd favor a bit more structured policy that dealt with personal attacks more vigorously. Such attacks do no good that I can see, and may well hurt the quality of the discourse. Such actions (the attacks) seem petty, childish and non productive.

FWIW, unless it's to correct some error (as I see such an error), I deal with such posters by not responding to their spoor and venom. Basically, I shun them.

IMO, these seemingly interminable and juvenile pissing matches detract from the quality of the forum and (while not assuming for one hot second anyone cares) have made me seriously consider severing contact. I respectfully assign some responsibility for allowing (to the point of tacitly condoning) what I consider abusive personal attacks by posters on a regular and predictable basis to the moderators and owners for letting it persist as long as it often does.

Still, there seem to be more than a few posters here who could benefit from a bit thicker skin.

Just my $0.02. Take what you want of the above. Scrap the rest.

[DanKegel]

That sounds fair to me. +1

I'd change "will jump in" to "may jump in". Don't want to overpromise.

If you can make it shorter, though, please do, lest eyes glaze over.

If the board is serious about the "don't mention installers by name" policy,
that deserves a mention, too.

So, maybe something like:

-- snip --
SolarPanelTalk is a great place to discuss anything and everything about solar energy - advantages and disadvantages, how to use it, how to get the most bang for the buck, problems to avoid, applicable laws, etc. etc.

Please do not post names of installers, or advertise your business, on this board. Please see the sister sites
http://www.solarreviews.com/ and http://www.solar-estimate.org/ for info about installers.

Please keep messages on topic. Discussions that veer off topic should move to the General Discussion area.
Personal attacks and trolling are always inappropriate.

Official site moderators may enforce these rules as appropriate; users are encouraged to use the Ignore List
(http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/profile.php?do=ignorelist) setting to avoid seeing messages from annoying people.
-- snip --

?

And please create a new thread for this discussion, it's gone off topic

[Willy T]

You moron. Liar Liar pants on fire. Such a huge lie any child can detect it. If LL was on your ignore list, you could not respond to him you idiot. Really stupid. Those username and time/date stamps hold up in court. So here are your signs.

Liar
Hack
Stupid.

You earned each and everyone of them. Misrepresentation is enough to get you BANNED WILLY.

You mean that someone would actually think a post like this is inappropriate, seems like it's business as usual. Why would anyone ever answer a post on here when they have to put up with this kind of trash.

[Mike90250]

I used to babysit when I was in high school, to make a buck. I did not get rich, not to good at it. Now 50 years later, I'm still not a good babysitter. Didn't think I'd need to be. I grew up, apparently others didn't.

So I try to deal with the technical stuff that I can, because my Marine Corps interpersonal relationship training (die enemy die) does not translate well to the web. So I often sit back and see if someone else can deal with the kids. Apparently it's beyond my guidance, 50 push-ups.

[Willy T]

I was called a LIAR about my Batteries, I posted the INVOICE.

I was called a LIAR about my home system and I posted the dated output.

I was called a LIAR, MORON and IDIOT about copying and pasting a Quote from a Ignored poster, I'll let you decide.

Now this person is worried about my boat and where I live ?? The belligerent posts only come from one person on here and everyone knows who it is.

[DanKegel]

Dereck is rarely convinced by factual proof when it is offered in a belligerent tone (internal auto-ignore?). But a polite correction of one of his statements is usually (eventually) graciously acknowledged.
De-escalation is preferred to escalation, as we have learned in several wars.
I do not want to see a "surge" on this board.

I don't think my tone was hostile. I'm trying to keep it as polite as possible.

Do the moderators feel it is ok to post a member's picture and offer to sell that member's social security number to anyone?

Do they feel it's ok to call someone an moron and a liar -- for posting something that turned out to be true -- and then not acknowledge the error when pointed out politely to them?

Are they not worried about the damage to the mood of the forum that actions like that can cause?

[Naptown]

I think everyone needs to calm down
A LOT!!!!!!

[solar pete]

Hi All,

Being a Mod is a dirty job as others have pointed out. I sure have no previous experience, and have probably been slow to learn. That being said I will seek consultation with the other mods (PM will be on the way soon) as to what we do with the current pissing match. Seems to me that newbies think they can run the show better, and are narky at SK as he can be quite rude at times. They seem to imply he is getting favorable treatment. I would remind those who seem to be hunting for SK that yes he does indeed get favorable consideration and this is due to his long service to this forum, these same people may be shocked to learn that I and other mods receive many messages where people want to alert the mods/admin that they are so happy that members on this forum (mostly SK) have helped them greatly, often saving them money or enabling them to do something safely.

Peace Out

[DanKegel]

I and other mods receive many messages where people want to alert the mods/admin that they are so happy that members on this forum (mostly SK) have helped them greatly, often saving them money or enabling them to do something safely.

There's no question that Sunking knows a lot about batteries, and he's very helpful when he wants to be.

I'm not at all gunning for Sunking. I am asking what the standards of the forum are, and how much leeway a really useful member should get when it comes to breaking the TOS and harassing other members in nasty ways.