How can I help solar system owners ?

[Haglun]

Hi everyone,
I would like to get your opinions and ideas to make your life easier, as solar system owners.
With a few engineer friends, we want to create a solution that would help solar system owners make the best of their solar system.

For example, with the decreasing FIT in several countries, it becomes more profitable to consume your production instead of feeding it to the grid.
So we are thinking of making an app to help control the consumption by making it match the PV production curve as much as possible using NILM and IoT. The options are pretty broad at the moment, the most important is that we create something that really helps PV owners - because we think that will contribute to spread renewable energies by making them more attractive.

Is there something that would make your life easier to manage your solar system ?
What are your biggest problems, or obstacles to reaching your objective ?

Please feel free to say anything you would want in general - we will think of a technical solution by ourselves.

Thank you in advance for your help !

[solar pete]

Hi Haglun and welcome to Solar Panel Talk, an app to help control consumption...hhmmm, might work on a modern house with all web enabled appliances cant see it working otherwise. Inverter manufactures like Fronius already have pretty cool functionality with the Fronius Smart Meter and the ability to match load and restrict export regarding grid voltages etc . Cheers.

[SunEagle]

I still do not understand the reason for not sending any power back onto the grid if the POCO allows it.

From what people on the forum have stated even getting only 2 cents/kWh is still better then nothing and IMO cheaper than a home energy storage system.

[ButchDeal]

I still do not understand the reason for not sending any power back onto the grid if the POCO allows it.

From what people on the forum have stated even getting only 2 cents/kWh is still better then nothing and IMO cheaper than a home energy storage system.

well if you can load shift when there is a FIT (not NET metering) then you get some benefit. Similar to a TOU situation.

not many loads can easily be load shifted though. you for example could adjust the thermostat a bit to reduce consumption when people are not there but pre-heat/pre-cool while solar is still produce, a slight shift to solar self consumption.
But you can't really shift all your refrigerator load to solar production hours, etc, without batteries.

FLEX tronics tried to do this (poorly) with their Wink and a monitoring system but never got rules and such set up right to easily effect consumption.

SolarEdge has some plans to do this as well with some smart outlets (so far only European outlets)
https://www.solaredge.com/sites/defa...-datasheet.pdf

with smart thermostats this should be more integrated but does't seem to be.

[motorcyclemikie]

What everyone needs is a management company for their gridtie systems. It has been estimated that 35% of PV energy is not fully utilized. The reasons for this range a broad spectrum, most of which are related to mismanagement. Solve that and take your percentage!

[SunEagle]

well if you can load shift when there is a FIT (not NET metering) then you get some benefit. Similar to a TOU situation.

not many loads can easily be load shifted though. you for example could adjust the thermostat a bit to reduce consumption when people are not there but pre-heat/pre-cool while solar is still produce, a slight shift to solar self consumption.
But you can't really shift all your refrigerator load to solar production hours, etc, without batteries.

FLEX tronics tried to do this (poorly) with their Wink and a monitoring system but never got rules and such set up right to easily effect consumption.

SolarEdge has some plans to do this as well with some smart outlets (so far only European outlets)
https://www.solaredge.com/sites/defa...-datasheet.pdf

with smart thermostats this should be more integrated but does't seem to be.

The idea of load shifting for TOU benefit makes sense but from what I read most POCO's (including mine) do not have a TOU rate structure. For that matter some POCO's actually have lower rates if you use more kWh's then not using it.

Still having a "smart system" to balance loads during high solar production would be a benefit to some but not everyone.

[ButchDeal]

The idea of load shifting for TOU benefit makes sense but from what I read most POCO's (including mine) do not have a TOU rate structure. For that matter some POCO's actually have lower rates if you use more kWh's then not using it.

Still having a "smart system" to balance loads during high solar production would be a benefit to some but not everyone.

OP was talking about areas ( europ ) where there is a FiT that is less than retail rate. For them self consumption is a bit more lucrative than the FiT but only if you can shift he load easily.

zero. benefit to most NET metering, especially without ToU

[ButchDeal]

What everyone needs is a management company for their gridtie systems. It has been estimated that 35% of PV energy is not fully utilized. The reasons for this range a broad spectrum, most of which are related to mismanagement. Solve that and take your percentage!

I am sure you have some point here but I can not cypher it out. Also not sure where or what this 35% is talking about.
35% of energy from installed system?
35% of insolation that hits the earth?
Neiher makes any since.

What exactly would a management comoany do for a grid tie system? Monitor it? Clean it? Warranty it?

You seem to be correlating this odd 35% figure to miis managment but of solar systems which need very little management. Kind of like the rest of the electrical system in your home.

[SunEagle]

OP was talking about areas ( europ ) where there is a FiT that is less than retail rate. For them self consumption is a bit more lucrative than the FiT but only if you can shift he load easily.

zero. benefit to most NET metering, especially without ToU

Thanks I understand the OP now.

[Haglun]

Thank you for your replies.
I think what motorcyclemike means is that a good share of the PV production is not used effectively, probably because it is not produced when consumption is actually highest.
My understanding of Feed-In Tariff is that it's an incentive to jump start the solar industry; but it does cost money to the government/state, so it will decrease at some point. Hence this question about self-consumption - but I understand that it is not really a big concern to you.

What are your main concerns, then ?
Is there something you find difficult or troublesome (e.g maintenance, monitoring, keeping track of finance etc ...) ?

[Mike90250]

Best help: Sales droids NOT making unrealistic promises that "will zero your electric bill, spay your cat, and keep the teens from sneaking out the bedroom window at night".

[bcroe]

A very basic problem with much renewable energy, is it is only intermittently available,
and will be lost if not collected at that time. Electricity may be wonderful, but storing it
for later is extremely difficult on a practical level. That is a problem that can only be
fixed by new technology, not software. A fact that many fail to understand. Bruce Roe

[J.P.M.]

Thank you for your replies.
I think what motorcyclemike means is that a good share of the PV production is not used effectively, probably because it is not produced when consumption is actually highest.
My understanding of Feed-In Tariff is that it's an incentive to jump start the solar industry; but it does cost money to the government/state, so it will decrease at some point. Hence this question about self-consumption - but I understand that it is not really a big concern to you.

What are your main concerns, then ?
Is there something you find difficult or troublesome (e.g maintenance, monitoring, keeping track of finance etc ...) ?

IMO Haglin, you're missing the bigger picture. The single biggest obstacle facing residential alternate energy is consumer ignorance of its possibilities and more importantly, its limitations. The second biggest obstacle is the amount and nature of con artists, and also perhaps well intentioned but ignorant tree huggers, both sets of folks existing pretty much for the sole purpose of making money off that ignorance, and using/claiming the "better" motives of making things "better"as little more than a red herring. Such goups have been around for eons and to my experience at least as long as I've been around alternate energy since the mid '70's. To me anyway, You/your outfit seem like you belong to one of those 2 groups of glommers. I've seen the M.O. too many times.

[sdold]

...we want to create a solution that would help solar system owners make the best of their solar system...Please feel free to say anything you would want in general - we will think of a technical solution by ourselves!

I'd stop using the term "solution" if I were you. It's vague and makes it sound as if you don't yet have an idea, or a plan.