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  • Net metering restored in Nevada

    This has been in the news a fair bit, but I'm not sure it was mentioned here yet, so:

    utilitydive.com/news/nevada-regulators-approve-net-metering-draft-order-for-nv-energy/504161/
    says

    -- snip --
    The Public Utilities Commission of Nevada last week approved an order setting net metering rates for NV Energy, the final step in revitalizing the state's rooftop solar industry after the program was eliminated two years ago.
    The PUC's decision orders the utility to charge solar and non-solar customers the same fees and sets compensation levels for tranches of capacity. NV Energy has until December 1 to implement the program.
    Earlier this summer, Nevada Gov. Brian Sandoval signed Assembly Bill 405, restoring net metering rates close to the retail level for rooftop solar customers following the state's 2015 decision to reduce compensation.
    ...
    The Nevada Independent reports the original order intimated that regulators must keep NV Energy "financially whole." That language was changed to "financially viable," to reflect risks inherent in the utility business.
    Under the new rules, rooftop solar customers will be compensated at 95% of the retail electricity rate for energy sent back to the grid. The credit declines overtime in 7% for every 80 MW of rooftop solar energy deployed until it reaches a floor rate at 75% of the retail rate.
    -- snip --

    It also requires the utility to allow net metering customers to keep it for 20 years.

    That sounds sensible. I wish they'd done something like that originally instead of trying to knife the baby as they did.
    Last edited by DanKegel; 09-06-2017, 11:46 PM.
    17kw. I like science, but I'm no expert.

  • #2
    There has been a lot of discussion about this at Solar Power International. For the most part people are happy with the decision (including the head of the PUC out here.) Several states, including Nevada, are looking to the New York's solution, mainly in the form of the transparent distributed energy price to fairly balance benefits/costs to the consumer vs benefits/costs to the utility.

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    • #3
      At the price point of the Tesla powerwall, and the track record of improvements to design and capacity, if Musk ever gets production going, these utility companies are going to be in big trouble...

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Murby View Post
        At the price point of the Tesla powerwall, and the track record of improvements to design and capacity, if Musk ever gets production going, these utility companies are going to be in big trouble...
        Unless storage investment+replacement costs come down or utility power prices go up, such that stored kilowatt-hours are no longer several times more expensive than kilowatt-hours from the grid, I doubt it.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Murby View Post
          At the price point of the Tesla powerwall, and the track record of improvements to design and capacity, if Musk ever gets production going, these utility companies are going to be in big trouble...
          I tend to doubt that. Completely off grid power seems pretty easy (get some solar panels and a Powerwall) but the reality is far more complex, as people here have learned. 99.9% of people out there are going to want to be able to get power cheaply/reliably by turning on a switch.

          That being said, the grid itself may well start to rely more and more on battery storage; it is ramping up similar to the rate solar was ramping up in 2010.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Murby View Post
            At the price point of the Tesla powerwall, and the track record of improvements to design and capacity, if Musk ever gets production going, these utility companies are going to be in big trouble...
            No way. Utilities will adapt and modify just like they do now. It will be a very, very long time before off-grid is any threat.
            Dave W. Gilbert AZ
            6.63kW grid-tie owner

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Murby View Post
              At the price point of the Tesla powerwall, and the track record of improvements to design and capacity, if Musk ever gets production going, these utility companies are going to be in big trouble...
              I am afraid that the only place a home battery system will pay for itself are with POCO's that charge you and arm and a leg for a kWh. And the number of POCO's that do that are few and far between since the average cost in the US is about $0.12/kWh and no way will a home energy storage system will pay for itself at that price.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by azdave View Post

                No way. Utilities will adapt and modify just like they do now. It will be a very, very long time before off-grid is any threat.
                may be- or may be new battery types will make utilities 'behave' price wise as if they jack up prices >50 c/kWh going off grid might start looking feasible:
                20 kWh house would need about 70 100Ah LFP cells at the cost of $100/cell to the total of $7000 + say $3000 for the rest. Given yearly bill for such house of 3,650 the breakeven period for such system is only 3 years. Well, you'd need to add PV breakeven of another 7 years and LFP can potentially pull it off so as you can see somewhere around that level things start to make sense.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by max2k View Post

                  may be- or may be new battery types will make utilities 'behave' price wise as if they jack up prices >50 c/kWh going off grid might start looking feasible:
                  20 kWh house would need about 70 100Ah LFP cells at the cost of $100/cell to the total of $7000 + say $3000 for the rest. Given yearly bill for such house of 3,650 the breakeven period for such system is only 3 years. Well, you'd need to add PV breakeven of another 7 years and LFP can potentially pull it off so as you can see somewhere around that level things start to make sense.
                  I doubt electric rates will climb up to $0.50/kWh any time soon unless something creates an issue causing the price to generate power 24/7 to go up.

                  One possible thing that can do that would be if the POCO's were forced to shut down all of the coal, natural gas and oil burning generating plants due to social media pressure concerning CO2 emissions.

                  Of course then the focus would be on transportation and the elimination of ICE driven vehicles. Good luck shutting down the trucking business.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by SunEagle View Post

                    I doubt electric rates will climb up to $0.50/kWh any time soon unless something creates an issue causing the price to generate power 24/7 to go up.

                    One possible thing that can do that would be if the POCO's were forced to shut down all of the coal, natural gas and oil burning generating plants due to social media pressure concerning CO2 emissions.

                    Of course then the focus would be on transportation and the elimination of ICE driven vehicles. Good luck shutting down the trucking business.
                    That would be true if decisions were driven by common sense. Here in CA they are often driven as you pointed out based on political agenda and our rates are getting close to that mark, about half way there already. BTW trucking business might get shut down by automatically driven vehicles before even ICE cars going out of fashion.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by max2k View Post

                      That would be true if decisions were driven by common sense. Here in CA they are often driven as you pointed out based on political agenda and our rates are getting close to that mark, about half way there already. BTW trucking business might get shut down by automatically driven vehicles before even ICE cars going out of fashion.
                      I am looking forward to more EV vehicles in the near future. I plan on getting one sometime in the future.

                      Unfortunately long distance shipping will need to find a way to extend the distance for electric versions that diesel trucks currently run. Automatic driven electric vehicles will still be limited to city deliveries which are short distance runs

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by SunEagle View Post

                        I am looking forward to more EV vehicles in the near future. I plan on getting one sometime in the future.

                        Unfortunately long distance shipping will need to find a way to extend the distance for electric versions that diesel trucks currently run. Automatic driven electric vehicles will still be limited to city deliveries which are short distance runs
                        On the other hand, interstate highway runs for driverless vehicles might, in some version of a limit, run on restricted/dedicated lanes with their own continuous power source, not unlike electric trains/busses do now, only without a driver, and get on/off as needed for local/short distance del.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by max2k View Post

                          That would be true if decisions were driven by common sense. Here in CA they are often driven as you pointed out based on political agenda and our rates are getting close to that mark, about half way there already. BTW trucking business might get shut down by automatically driven vehicles before even ICE cars going out of fashion.
                          I don't see how trucking businesses would get shut down by driverless vehicles. I can see how maybe employment opportunities for driving professionals might be reduced, but I don't see how that would jeopardize the trucking business. Commerce still needs to proceed.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by J.P.M. View Post

                            On the other hand, interstate highway runs for driverless vehicles might, in some version of a limit, run on restricted/dedicated lanes with their own continuous power source, not unlike electric trains/busses do now, only without a driver, and get on/off as needed for local/short distance del.
                            That is a possibility but think of the cost to install that type of infrastructure. The vehicles will need to be as long as a train with hundreds of cars instead of the thousands of typical 18 wheeler containers

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by J.P.M. View Post

                              I don't see how trucking businesses would get shut down by driverless vehicles. I can see how maybe employment opportunities for driving professionals might be reduced, but I don't see how that would jeopardize the trucking business. Commerce still needs to proceed.
                              thanks for correction- of course stuff needs to be moved around by some means. What I meant is the business of small trucking operators who own/lease a truck and making living driving it around.

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