now what :)

[tkalfaoglu]

So have you calculated how much that ( not so ) " free" energy is costing you

No; I'm too scared.. For reference, A 100-Watt panel costs at least $125 here.. The battery is about the same..

[ButchDeal]

No; I'm too scared.. For reference, A 100-Watt panel costs at least $125 here.. The battery is about the same..

So $500 for 200w solar and 2 batteries plus charge controller, inverter, cables, fuses, battery box, vent pipe.

so let's say $700 all in and that the batteries lasts 8 years ( being generous )
at best it generates 1 kWh a day AC after all losses.
So 2.9 MWh over 8 years assuming zero failures ( modules would degrade and batteries as well over that time but keeping things simple)
then you need new batteries, another $250 to keep it going.
but for 8 years got got 2.9 MWh for $700 or $0.24/KWh (compared to grid cost of for OP of $0.10/kWh)
but if you let it going for another 8 years with the $250 investment in new batteries ( ignoring degradation) that would be 5.8MWh for 16 years at cost of $950
or $0.164/KWh.

but remember those production numbers and battery life are optimistic.

Off grid sucks for financial

Edit: correct math mistake on final pricing.

[tkalfaoglu]

That's very sad, I always thought that off-grid would be cheaper than being on-grid, since there is so much inefficiency in this country. I guess panels and batteries have not come down in price enough yet..

[SunEagle]

That's very sad, I always thought that off-grid would be cheaper than being on-grid, since there is so much inefficiency in this country. I guess panels and batteries have not come down in price enough yet..

The price of solar hardware and some batteries have gone down in price. The problem is unless you live somewhere that the cost of power is > $0.50/kWh it is almost impossible to justify the cost of being off grid and will be for some time until the price of batteries get low enough that they can deliver power for about $0.25/kWh.

[ButchDeal]

That's very sad, I always thought that off-grid would be cheaper than being on-grid, since there is so much inefficiency in this country. I guess panels and batteries have not come down in price enough yet..

Off grid is VERY inefficient. The grid though is efficient. Net metering my nature is 100% efficient to the homeowner, and at drastically lower cost.


Off grid usually also comes with drastic reductions in consumption, due to the drastic increase in production costs.

[J.P.M.]

That's very sad, I always thought that off-grid would be cheaper than being on-grid, since there is so much inefficiency in this country. I guess panels and batteries have not come down in price enough yet..

You thought wrong, at least for now.

[inetdog]

So $500 for 200w solar and 2 batteries plus charge controller, inverter, cables, fuses, battery box, vent pipe.

so let's say $700 all in and that the batteries lasts 8 years ( being generous )
at best it generates 1 kWh a day AC after all losses.
So 2.9 MWh over 8 years assuming zero failures ( modules would degrade and batteries as well over that time but keeping things simple)
then you need new batteries, another $250 to keep it going.
but for 8 years got got 2.9 MWh for $700 or $0.24/KWh (compared to grid cost of for OP of $0.10/kWh)
but if you let it going for another 8 years with the $250 investment in new batteries ( ignoring degradation) that would be 5.8MWh for 16 years at cost of $950
or $0.164/KWh.

but remember those production numbers and battery life are optimistic.

Off grid sucks for financial

Edit: corrected math mistake on final pricing.

Lets try the math again, OK?

.700 kilodollars divided by 2.9MWh equals .241 dollars per kWh.
.950 kilodollars divided by 5.8MWh equals .164 dollars per kWh.

You should have been suspicious of your numbers when twice the energy for less than twice the cost seemed to be more expensive!
You appear to have divided kWh by cost to get a $/kWh figure.

Those number may not make sense in some part of the US, but would be great in Hawaii.

I am, however, still not convinced that all of the costs have been properly accounted for. And 8 years for the battery bank in that service is hopelessly optimistic except for the highest RE grade of FLA battery cared for meticulously.

[inetdog]

That's very sad, I always thought that off-grid would be cheaper than being on-grid, since there is so much inefficiency in this country. I guess panels and batteries have not come down in price enough yet..

Do not despair completely. See post above.
But still not good when an overly optimistic calculation still comes out higher then $.11 per kWh.

[ButchDeal]

Lets try the math again, OK?

.700 kilodollars divided by 2.9MWh equals .241 dollars per kWh.
.950 kilodollars divided by 5.8MWh equals .164 dollars per kWh.

You should have been suspicious of your numbers when twice the energy for less than twice the cost seemed to be more expensive!
You appear to have divided kWh by cost to get a $/kWh figure.

Those number may not make sense in some part of the US, but would be great in Hawaii.

I am, however, still not convinced that all of the costs have been properly accounted for. And 8 years for the battery bank in that service is hopelessly optimistic except for the highest RE grade of FLA battery cared for meticulously.

crap yep I screwed up at the end. was in too much of a hurry and thinking of other things. will correct the original post as it is too glaring of a mistake.

and yes as I stated the production is overly optimistic as well as the battery life.

[bcroe]

crap yep I screwed up at the end. was in too much of a hurry and thinking of other things.
will correct the original post as it is too glaring of a mistake.

The pits is, you can fix your own post, but you can't fix where somebody quoted it. Bruce Roe

[SunEagle]

The pits is, you can fix your own post, but you can't fix where somebody quoted it. Bruce Roe

If you ask nicely inetdog can make the changes in his post for Butch.

[Sunking]

That's very sad, I always thought that off-grid would be cheaper than being on-grid, since there is so much inefficiency in this country. I guess panels and batteries have not come down in price enough yet..

Price has nothing to do with it. You have been brainwashed. The issue with all batteries is EROI. it takes more energy to make a battery than the battery can deliver in its lifetime. In other words just makes you a heavy polluter.

[J.P.M.]

The pits is, you can fix your own post, but you can't fix where somebody quoted it. Bruce Roe

Kind of like the spoken word in a way: Once it leaves your mouth, it can't be taken back.

[ButchDeal]

If you ask nicely inetdog can make the changes in his post for Butch.

thats fine. I made the mistake I can own it. I just corrected the original one as I don't want the mistake propagating

[Mike90250]

Updated the quote so it's correct.