More panels or more batteries?

[coinmaster]

I have an off-grid cabin I'm building in new hampshire and the area is pretty woody. I plan on clearing out some of the trees in the immediate area but it's not like I can open up the horizon, being that far up north doesn't help either.
I plan on using about 5000 WH per day which is about 416 AH. My current plan is to get a 1000ah battery system with 2000w of panels. Given my location should I go with more batteries or more panels or am I good?

[sensij]

More of both. Check out the off-grid sticky as a place to get started, refine from there:

https://www.solarpaneltalk.com/forum...battery-design

[coinmaster]

Okay I read it. It doesn't give me a lot of hope

[organic farmer]

We are in Maine, our land is flat and dense forest. Our driveway runs East/West. Our solar panel array is also East/West parallel to the driveway, on the North side of the driveway, and 40' back from the driveway. On the South side of our driveway, we took down forest trees and planted fruit trees [which will be much shorter than the forest trees. The clearance for our solar array is more than enough.

[Amy@altE]

#1 Don't go 12V, do at least 24V, if not 48V. It'll be a better system.
#2 Is it year round, weekend only, 3 season? What did you use for sun hours to figure that array. It seems a bit small.
#3 Will you have a backup power source like a generator? If not, much more battery and solar needed.

[coinmaster]

Most if not all of my electronics will be run off of 12vDC, what's the advantage of 24v?
It's for year round.
No generator planned, last time I checked they don't last too long.

[gmanInPA]

I have an off-grid cabin I'm building in new hampshire and the area is pretty woody. I plan on clearing out some of the trees in the immediate area but it's not like I can open up the horizon, being that far up north doesn't help either.
I plan on using about 5000 WH per day which is about 416 AH. My current plan is to get a 1000ah battery system with 2000w of panels. Given my location should I go with more batteries or more panels or am I good?

I know this is not called "GeneratorTalk.com", but a generator should be an important part of your setup you're going to want/or need - unless you want a very large amount of batteries.

[gmanInPA]

Most if not all of my electronics will be run off of 12vDC, what's the advantage of 24v?
It's for year round.
No generator planned, last time I checked they don't last too long.

A good diesel generator will last a very long time if properly maintained.

[inetdog]

A good diesel generator will last a very long time if properly maintained.

But keep in mind the design difference between generators intended for intermittent use, which may have an emission control warranty that only covers 300 operating hours or even less, versus whole house generators warrantied to provide prime mover power for days at a time and testing every week whether they need it or not.
Maintaining a generator which is only used intermittently and without a schedule has its own problems, fortunately less so with diesel than with gasoline.

[gmanInPA]

But keep in mind the design difference between generators intended for intermittent use, which may have an emission control warranty that only covers 300 operating hours or even less, versus whole house generators warrantied to provide prime mover power for days at a time and testing every week whether they need it or not.
Maintaining a generator which is only used intermittently and without a schedule has its own problems, fortunately less so with diesel than with gasoline.

Agreed. Fortunately, there are good components available for exercising generators and the like - (for those without a daily need) though the software for mine (the Schneider AGS) is absolutely buggy and they seemingly have little concern for fixing it! For me, when I exercise my generator - it isn't for 15 minutes, but a few hours and I use the power during that duration. It might cost me fuel but it helps prevent some of the unpleasantness of running a diesel generator for only a few minutes. It's also a more realistic test of the generator's health.

[Amy@altE]

Off grid, year round in NH, with no generator? Yikes. That's a recipe for failure. I have one word for you. December.
With 3 sun hours, and that's assuming perfect conditions, no shade, you'd need 5000Wh / 3 sun hours / /65 system losses = 2500W solar. That's assuming you get full sun right after a cloudy day to fill the battery bank up. 3500W is probably more accurate.

3500W into a 12V battery bank = 300 amps. That's way too much. 3500W into a 48V battery bank = 73A, that's more manageable.

For battery bank, 5000Wh / 2 (50% DoD) x 5 days autonomy (needed without a genny) x 1.2 temperature compensation (guessing on storage temp of batteries) / 48V = 1250Ah 48V battery bank. (If it was a 12V battery bank, it'd be 5000Ah, just not doable).

I suggest you call a solar equipment provider that can help you out with the system requirements and perhaps come up with some alternative ideas.

[Sunking]

It cannot be a 12 volt system. That would be very foolish and extremely dangerous. Your batteries will have to be much larger than you have predicted and a Generator is a must have item to protect your $6000, 1500 pound battery you get to replace every few years. Without generator replace them every year.

Is that a problem for you?

[almac]

I know this is not called "GeneratorTalk.com", but a generator should be an important part of your setup you're going to want/or need - unless you want a very large amount of batteries.

something not mentioned often when contemplating off grid living is changing your usage habits. being on the grid you get used to having unlimited power. you can get by with alot less battery storage if you plan your usage times, use larger loads during daytime, batteries are only for the night. use a chest freezer , a vertical fridge dumps the stored cold air out every time you open the door. place frozen water bottles in your chest freezer and only run it daytime with a timer. i have 1.5kw of panels but get by with 100 AH battery at 24v for night use ie, tv , laptop ,lights.

[Logan005]

Agreed, Off Grid living requires huge lifestyle changes and or Huge batteries, and a generator. a Basic off grid system should be 24 volts. If you want a serious off grid system you chose 48 volts. If you live off grid you are going to want a chest freezer and chest Refrigerator. A small microwave can be useful but very lite occasional use, Big NO' NO's, Toaster, Toaster oven, the heat plate in most automatic drip coffee makers. electric cook tops, electric range oven. electric hot water heaters. for these luxury you use propane. perk coffee or French press from kettle heated with gas or on wood stove.

[Mike90250]

I've got 5Kw of panels, about 6500wh daily winter loads, and had about 14 hours of generator run time THIS month. 3 cloudy days with out generator, and your house goes dark and the batteries are fried. Seems like lots of folks are liking the Honda eu2000 (1600w rated) generator, if you don't need 240VAC.