RV converter question? Going (mostly) off grid.

[PNW_Steve]

Hello Everyone,

I am working on improving the self sufficiency of my 5th wheel trailer in preparation for an extended road trip. I have been looking at energy saving, solar and generator options. In an attempt to educate myself better as to the actual power consumption I bought a kill-a-watt meter to start gauging the actual usage of individual items.

I started by plugging in the shore power cord to look at parasitic loads. The refrigerator is not connected. The water heater is non-electronic. The only items I can identify that are consuming power are the 12v converter/charger and the microwave oven. Sitting idle with the only activity being the clock on the microwave and maintaining the house battery I am consuming 1.6kWh daily. I was shocked.

I cannot imagine that the microwave is using more than 10% of that. The converter/charger is looking like a big parasitic PIG! I am considering removing it as well as the existing house battery and replacing them with a Samlex DC-DC converter fed from my 24v solar bank.

Anyone have any experience with this?

My 12v DC loads should be minimal. I have converted to LED lighting and not much else requires 12v.

Thanks

Steve

[SunEagle]

Hello Everyone,

I am working on improving the self sufficiency of my 5th wheel trailer in preparation for an extended road trip. I have been looking at energy saving, solar and generator options. In an attempt to educate myself better as to the actual power consumption I bought a kill-a-watt meter to start gauging the actual usage of individual items.

I started by plugging in the shore power cord to look at parasitic loads. The refrigerator is not connected. The water heater is non-electronic. The only items I can identify that are consuming power are the 12v converter/charger and the microwave oven. Sitting idle with the only activity being the clock on the microwave and maintaining the house battery I am consuming 1.6kWh daily. I was shocked.

I cannot imagine that the microwave is using more than 10% of that. The converter/charger is looking like a big parasitic PIG! I am considering removing it as well as the existing house battery and replacing them with a Samlex DC-DC converter fed from my 24v solar bank.

Anyone have any experience with this?

My 12v DC loads should be minimal. I have converted to LED lighting and not much else requires 12v.

Thanks

Steve

Sounds like there is a vampire load somewhere. That 1600watt hours in a 24 hour period is about 67watts per hour. It could be the "no load" usage of your converter/charger. What is the make and model and have you checked on it's specifications for no load drain.

My frig can run off the propane tank but the controller runs off the coach batteries. Is your frig really disconnected or running off of propane?

Also a lot of electronics like TV's may be off but they still suck some power. That includes any cable or satellite control box. If it is plugged in it may be drawing some power even if it is turned off.

[bcroe]

I am working on improving the self sufficiency of my 5th wheel trailer in preparation for an extended road trip. I have been looking at energy saving, solar and generator options. In an attempt to educate myself better as to the actual power consumption I bought a kill-a-watt meter to start gauging the actual usage of individual items.

I started by plugging in the shore power cord to look at parasitic loads. The refrigerator is not connected. The water heater is non-electronic. The only items I can identify that are consuming power are the 12v converter/charger and the microwave oven. Sitting idle with the only activity being the clock on the microwave and maintaining the house battery I am consuming 1.6kWh daily. I was shocked.

I cannot imagine that the microwave is using more than 10% of that. The converter/charger is looking like a big parasitic PIG! I am considering removing it as well as the existing house battery and replacing them with a Samlex DC-DC converter fed from my 24v solar bank.

My 12v DC loads should be minimal. I have converted to LED lighting and not much else requires 12v.
Thanks Steve

Finding the parasitic loads is a great starting point, something I did several years ago. Once
they have been identified, you can work up a solution for each. In some cases just unplug
them. I found my microwave was using more KWH off than in the few minutes it got used.
Unplugging works, but I devised a control that completely disconnects it from the line 7 minutes
AFTER it stops cooking. Opening the door reconnects it long enough to start cooking.

I had a lot of battery maintainers. I found that they used almost as much power when charge
current was shut down, compared to heavy charging. My solution was to design a battery
charger with practically no standby power. Bruce Roe

[PNW_Steve]

Sounds like there is a vampire load somewhere. That 1600watt hours in a 24 hour period is about 67watts per hour. It could be the "no load" usage of your converter/charger. What is the make and model and have you checked on it's specifications for no load drain.

My frig can run off the propane tank but the controller runs off the coach batteries. Is your frig really disconnected or running off of propane?

Also a lot of electronics like TV's may be off but they still suck some power. That includes any cable or satellite control box. If it is plugged in it may be drawing some power even if it is turned off.

Thanks for the reply.

I don't have details on the converter yet. It is hurried behind a bulkhead with no provision for service access.

The fridge failed and has been removed. There are currently no electronics (tv, satellite receive, computer etc) in the trailer.

The only items I can identify that are consuming power are the converter and the microwave oven. I had thought that unplugging the microwave would help me eliminate it but the plug is difficult to access. It just occurred to me that I can isolate it at the breaker panel. I will do that tomorrow.

I also considered that a failing house battery could cause the high consumption.. The house battery is 6 months old. I unplugged shore power and left it overnight. When I checked the battery the next day it showed 12.7volts.

It is looking to me like the 22 year old converter is the likely culprit. That is why I am considering disconnecting the 12v house battery and converter & replacing them with a 24 to 12 volt dc-dc converter.

[Mustang65]

Rewire 5th wheeler charge controller

The 1st thing I did when I installed solar on my Travel Trailer was to rewire the Trailers charge controller to its own AC breaker, so I had the ability to turn it "OFF" when I was on the inverter/solar or "ON" when the sun was not producing enough and I had access to shore power. I wired my Trailer so that I can select Shore power or inverter by selecting the outlet supplying power (see picture). This is a lot cheaper than a $2,500 auto transfer switch. 99% of the time it stays plugged into the inverter. So far no complaints...

Just my thoughts,

Don

10ShorePower or Inverter.jpg

2013 Jayco Eagle 284BHS
250Watt Grape Solar Panel, MorningStar MPPT 60 Charge Controller
1500 Watt Ramsond PSI, 2 Trojan T145 Batteries (260Ah)
2 - AirSight Wireless IP Cameras (used as rear view cameras)
EnGenius WI-FI extender, D-Link wireless (n) modem
MagicJack Internet Phone
2012 Ford F150XLT, EcoBoost w/3.73
157" Wheel base, HD Towing Package

[PNW_Steve]

The 1st thing I did when I installed solar on my Travel Trailer was to rewire the Trailers charge controller to its own AC breaker, so I had the ability to turn it "OFF" when I was on the inverter/solar or "ON" when the sun was not producing enough and I had access to shore power. I wired my Trailer so that I can select Shore power or inverter by selecting the outlet supplying power (see picture). This is a lot cheaper than a $2,500 auto transfer switch. 99% of the time it stays plugged into the inverter. So far no complaints...

Just my thoughts,

Don

[ATTACH=CONFIG]4782[/ATTACH]

Good thought. I can rewire so that the existing converter only sees power when on shore or generator. As little as the load is on the 12v system I think I will be able to keep it charged with an hour or so of generator run daily.

When I dry camp I am in the habit of running the genny while fixing coffee & breakfast every morning.

[ZoNiE]

Good thought. I can rewire so that the existing converter only sees power when on shore or generator. As little as the load is on the 12v system I think I will be able to keep it charged with an hour or so of generator run daily.

When I dry camp I am in the habit of running the genny while fixing coffee & breakfast every morning.

Doesn't anyone make coffee and breakfast on the propane STOVE?

Not nitpicking, just wondering.

I have a french press and a percolator with a preference to the percolator and Chock full O nuts. Sort of a tradition when camping in my family now...

BTW, those converters are Hogs, and the older, the worse they are. Many old "Buzz Boxes" are little more than a big transformer and a bridge.

[Sunking]

Doesn't anyone make coffee and breakfast on the propane STOVE?

What a luxury, we used the camp fire.

[SunEagle]

What a luxury, we used the camp fire.

Sometimes we have gone camping when there was a fire watch so no open fires.

I do like to grill over a fire. Seems more like the camping I use to do when we tented. Now with the RV both wife and I got spoiled.

[PNW_Steve]

Doesn't anyone make coffee and breakfast on the propane STOVE?

Not nitpicking, just wondering.

I have a french press and a percolator with a preference to the percolator and Chock full O nuts. Sort of a tradition when camping in my family now...

BTW, those converters are Hogs, and the older, the worse they are. Many old "Buzz Boxes" are little more than a big transformer and a bridge.

Propane stove, microwave oven, coffee grinder and drip coffee maker for fixing breakfast. Then the wife's hair dryer.

I wouldn't call what we do "camping". We do spend a fair bit of time in places with no hookups but you will not see a sleeping bag or tent in my kit.

I like your description of the converter as a "buzz box". In a quiet spot you can hear mine 10' away.

[PNW_Steve]

Sometimes we have gone camping when there was a fire watch so no open fires.

I do like to grill over a fire. Seems more like the camping I use to do when we tented. Now with the RV both wife and I got spoiled.

Many of our summer destinations don't allow fires. I agree that the best way to cook steaks & burgers is over a wood fire.

[Mustang65]

Propane stove, microwave oven, coffee grinder and drip coffee maker for fixing breakfast. Then the wife's hair dryer.

I wouldn't call what we do "camping". We do spend a fair bit of time in places with no hookups but you will not see a sleeping bag or tent in my kit.

I like your description of the converter as a "buzz box". In a quiet spot you can hear mine 10' away.

Now days it is more like the Embassy Suites on wheels...

Don

[PNW_Steve]

Now days it is more like the Embassy Suites on wheels...

Don

When I was full time I had a converted Eagle 10. 8kw diesel genny, satellite tv, convection oven, full size shower, custom cabinets, tile floors etc. Definitely NOT camping...

[SunEagle]

When I was full time I had a converted Eagle 10. 8kw diesel genny, satellite tv, convection oven, full size shower, custom cabinets, tile floors etc. Definitely NOT camping...

But if it makes the wife happy so be it.

I wanted to just get a travel trailer to haul around behind my Tundra. She wanted to be able to have a potty break without stopping. So we bought a 2005 35ft Class A Damon Challenger about a 18 months ago. Not as luxurious as some of the Class A's out there but definitely a very comfortable RV.

[ZoNiE]

But if it makes the wife happy so be it.

I wanted to just get a travel trailer to haul around behind my Tundra. She wanted to be able to have a potty break without stopping. So we bought a 2005 35ft Class A Damon Challenger about a 18 months ago. Not as luxurious as some of the Class A's out there but definitely a very comfortable RV.

X2. Gets wifey jazzed about getting away from people since we have a toilet, shower, and climate control. Motorhome was nice, but TT is more reliable.