LiFePO4 - The future for off-grid battery banks?

[livesley]

LIVERSLEY an afordable low mantanece battery bank id like to hear any sergestions? Its not an easy question to answer .. Affordable? it depends as to how you determine that.. Affordable up front?? Affordable over many years??? Standard lead acid deep cycle batteries (12v)are the lowest cost,2v cells of high ahr are far more expensive and need regular maintainance and equalizing,(not easy with solar chargers) but if good quality like Surrette will have long life if very carefully maintained. Lithium ion phosphate batteries have the potential to have very long life if used in a solar energy setup. but have very high initial cost.. but no maintainance

Affordable i would say more in the ways of cost over its dorasion in its life & not so exspencive it out ways getting connected to the grid & paying for it for the next 10 - 15 years the costing wise gwl power ive allready been speaking with comes out very Affordable thanks.

[Sunking]

Affordable i would say more in the ways of cost over its dorasion in its life & not so exspencive it out ways getting connected to the grid & paying for it for the next 10 - 15 years the costing wise gwl power ive allready been speaking with comes out very Affordable thanks.

Might want to do some math as power from batteries works out to 10 times more than buying from the grid for the rest of your life for most folks.

[john p]

its a sad fact but Sunking is correct.. For most people that use batteries off grid its not a matter of of choice its a matter of necessity.
ie I and some others use off grid lighting in Philippines for the simple fact we get (brownouts) or more correctly of course called blackouts at least once every 2 weeks ranging from hours to many days. The security of having lights is priceless.

[livesley]

Might want to do some math as power from batteries works out to 10 times more than buying from the grid for the rest of your life for most folks.

the simple math of it is to get connected to the grid here in france it costs just under 2000

[Iron Bran]

New battery systems

Hey everyone, I have been reading your post about these alternative battery systems.

There is another option that you must consider - Nickel Iron.

If you take into consideration the future replacement costs of any other battery system, then paying a little more up front is really worth it.

[Sunking]

Hey everyone, I have been reading your post about these alternative battery systems.

There is another option that you must consider - Nickel Iron.

If you take into consideration the future replacement costs of any other battery system, then paying a little more up front is really worth it.

Right, who in their right mind will pay 10 to 40 times more for a battery, and has to add 40% more solar panel wattage to make up for their lousy charge efficiency. Edison did not renew his patent, and Exide quit making them in 1974 for a reason.

[Arctic Donkey]

steveg,

Any particular reason you went with Seiden over others like Winston or CALB?

Not a lot of time has passed since you posted the information about your setup, but any new updates would be appreciated.

[livesley]

i personly havent looked any more into the batteries

after doing a bit of tweeking with my system its doing extremly well capabilertys of 10,000wh 200ah . ive moved my panels (15 X 80w 21volts max each) to slightly due east 35 degrees angle fixed manly set for the winter 3 banks of 5 putting out 105volts on each bank bigger cables running through a mppt tristar feeding my 48v bank of 16 x Yuasa EN160-6 VRLA Batteries feeding my new studer aj400 inverter for general running (studer great bit of kit low consuption amazing 1000w serge cerpacity) & an old 6000w ups for bigger stuff washing machine etc linked up to my lister 6kva generator to charge my batteries (only run the generator for about 100hous total in winter used about 12 liters of diesel) all in a sound proof box half under ground o & my wind turbine has had a blade up grade now its doing a bit better need to get my other tristar linked up to see what thats doing.but now ive got electric to burn welders been goin large power tools & still fully charge at the end of the day . the mppt tristar is great just go on the laptop to check every thing trying to get it on a web page for any one to see all in all

[isoutar]

price comparison of lead acid to nickel iron is only about 3 to 4 times

There is an incorrect figure below ... nickel iron batteries cost about 3 to 4 times more than the highest quality industrial single cell lead acid batteries.

For a number of decades now the price differential has been 3 to 4 times (not 10 to 40 as indicated in the post quoted below).

Ian Soutar
Vancouver Isalnd
BC Canada

Right, who in their right mind will pay 10 to 40 times more for a battery, and has to add 40% more solar panel wattage to make up for their lousy charge efficiency. Edison did not renew his patent, and Exide quit making them in 1974 for a reason.

[Sunking]

There is an incorrect figure below

No I am correct and you know it. Even your own website you use to promote your products verifies my claim

Top end 10 year Lead Acid batteries cost $0.14/Kwh
From your own website cost for NiFe $1.60 to $6.0/wh.

Ian you can argue all you want, but the facts are facts NiFe cost are 11 to 47 times higher.

[Mike90250]

Lets not pull this LiFePO4 thread off into Pb vs NiFe.... please.

[david3]

Any idea which battery management system to use if you were to get a set of large AH batteries for a solar-electric system? Like 400AH or 700AH cells (x16)?

While there are lots of battery management systems out there, details on them are often sketchy. And many seem to be for smaller batteries.

[SteveC]

Are you talking about controllers?? I have an 1875 amp hr. bank charged by a 2000 w. array [12 v. battery] and use two Outback MX60s [now they sell the newer FM 60]. Works great. There are a number of similar controllers out there. The array and bank have been working for many years, no problem.

Is this what you're asking about??

[Sunking]

Are you talking about controllers??

No he is talking about a BMS

[john p]

david3 you certainly are going to need a BMS or the cells are going to have an unhappy life. Easy to make for cells below 20ah but harder for ones you need for over 700ah. You should consult the manufacturer of the cells see what they recommend. I have noticed they seem a bit overpriced all of them but in the total scheme mabe not that much extra expense. But you are going to have to use one.