Wrong configuration?

[Donniebosko]

Need help. I bought a 200 watt kit from Grape Solar. (2x100 watt panels, inverter, and C40 Controller). Panels are wired positive to charge controller, negative to battery. negative from battery to charge controller. then positive and negative from battery to inverter. I have a 12v 95ah gelcell battery. charge controller stays on 1 blink(green). i am running a 13 watt led light and a water heater that draws 125 watts when it runs. it is in a chicken coop. Once in a while i see the charge controller with 3 or 4 blinks while the system is disconnected from the light and heater. when i first installed the battery, it ran for 2 1/2 days. now, it lasts only a few hours. so, it is not charging the battery. I had it charging for 3 days before running it again.
Do I have it wired incorrectly?
Does the gel cell change the configuration?
I installed the charge controller with no changes made to it from the factory. it is in charge control mode. Please help.

[sensij]

Sounds like the battery is dead. Gel batteries generally require a lower charge voltage than other types, and can be more easily damaged by overcharging.

http://www.dekabatteries.com/assets/base/0139.pdf

According to the charge controller manual, the default charge voltage is at a safe level, although you might want to double check. See page 79 for settings, and page 22 for how to adjust it. Do you have the temperature compensation sensor attached to the battery?

https://www.altestore.com/mmsolar/Others/C_Series_User_Guide.pdf

Even if you've got the voltage right, some gel batteries require a much lower charge current to avoid damage, 2 X 100 W panels could be putting out 10 A... C/10 might be too much. Have you double checked with your battery supplier for any documentation?

Even if the charge settings are right, over discharging the battery or chronically undercharging it would kill it too. How many hours/day is the light on, and how long is the water heat cycle? Your battery has only 12*95 = 1140 Wh of energy, and discharging past 50% will shorten the life. The effective capacity might even be less than that in your application, since the capacity is based on a 20 hour discharge rate (steady 4.75 A), while your water heater will pull double that.

This time of year, the amount of sunlight available to charge is dropping fast. Even if your system was balanced in the summer, it might not be now, leading to undercharging.

[Donniebosko]

This is a new battery. When I first hooked it up, it ran for 2 1/2 days and then died overnight. The water heater is thermostatically controlled and only draws as needed. My best guess is a maximum draw of 3 hours at 125 watts. That should be a total of roughly 50 amps a day with the 13 watt light on at 14 hours a day. Just to be clear, this gel battery is an AGM, not a sealed gel lead acid.

[Raul]

I think you wired the panels wrong. Positive AND NEGATIVE from panels goes to charge Controler first then from there to batt.
Your description sounds like you got your panel negative to battery? That's wrong. No wonder you are not charging.

[Donniebosko]

I originally had them wired that way, Raul. Directly to the charge controller. The batteries did not charge at all that way. I found a video on you tube showing it the way I have it now. The battery does charge this way but, still not the way I think it should. It starts with one blink. I have seen it get to a solid blink. Then I come back a few hours later, and it's just one blink again. All while there is nothing drawing from it. The inverter is hooked up but, not switched on.

[Raul]

Have a look at page 59 in the link posted above by sensij.

[ILFE]

I originally had them wired that way, Raul. Directly to the charge controller. The batteries did not charge at all that way. I found a video on you tube showing it the way I have it now. The battery does charge this way but, still not the way I think it should. It starts with one blink. I have seen it get to a solid blink. Then I come back a few hours later, and it's just one blink again. All while there is nothing drawing from it. The inverter is hooked up but, not switched on.

Could you please supply a link to the video in question?

[sensij]

Have a look at page 59 in the link posted above by sensij.

All of the DC- is on a common bus, so it doesn't really matter if the PV- is wired to the CC or to the battery, as long as the DC- is connected to the CC somewhere.

Running the battery for 2.5 days until the electronics shut down is probably discharging it past safe levels, based on the loads described. Just because the battery is new doesn't mean it can't be hurt by misuse.

To really figure out what the charge controller is doing, some measurements would help. What is the voltage of the battery before the charging starts? What is it after the charging is done for the day? Measuring the amperage would help too.

Where is this system located (approximately)? At what orientation have the panels been installed (direction and tilt)? Is there any shade?

[Donniebosko]

Okay, I've disconnected and reconnected according to the manual. Not enough sun left today for any results. I'm in NH. I'll let you all know tomorrow or over the weekend, depending on sunshine. I looked for the video I referenced and I can't find it. I did find two others though that support the panel neg to the charge controller. So, it is now pos and neg from panels to charge controller. Then to battery and then to the inverter. This is how I originally had it. Now, we wait. 🤔

[Donniebosko]

To follow up to sensij, the panels are mounted level and tilted to 43 degrees.. That is where I am in relation to the equator. They are pointed south. As far as the measurements of the battery go, I have a multimeter but I'm trying to learn how to use it. Please believe that I'm not a dummy... It's just that electricity has my respect. I'm common sense handy and can do it all. My problem is that I don't know this particular realm of alternative energy. So far, I've found that it's initially expensive. And frustrating. ....😠

[Sunking]

This is a new battery. When I first hooked it up, it ran for 2 1/2 days and then died overnight. The water heater is thermostatically controlled and only draws as needed. My best guess is a maximum draw of 3 hours at 125 watts. That should be a total of roughly 50 amps a day with the 13 watt light on at 14 hours a day. Just to be clear, this gel battery is an AGM, not a sealed gel lead acid.

From the sounds of it you are in deficit charging. Meaning both your battery size and panel wattage is way to low. The battery if properly sized should last a minimum 5 days. You have made the same mistake 90% of off-griders make. Your system is grossly undersized. You made the most common mistake. You failed to plan and GUESSED.

[Donniebosko]

Thanks so much Sunking for pointing all this out. You must be standing there with your arms folded and looking at me with a smug smile of superiority and thinking how sweet it would be to flay me alive in the public square. I'm sure that you also read that I clearly stated I was learning. I'm pretty sure guessing is part of learning. I also admitted that I don't know this area of electricity at all. I am here looking for a solution. So, while you ridicule me and refer to me as an "off-grider"(your spelling) like I'm a lower form of life than you, could you use that air of superiority to offer up a solution? You call yourself a solar fanatic so, you must surely have a solution..... A 12v 95ah battery and 2x100 watt panels are not enough to run a 13 watt draw and a 125 watt draw for a max of 3 hours a day and then 13 watts at an additional 11 hours a day. The guessing part is assuming the worst case scenario on the draw. That seems like a good amount of battery to me but I do plan on doubling that up. Any other help you can offer would be appreciated. Derisive ridicule and insults are not needed. I'll just return the favor and I really don't want to do that. I just need help with this, not Captain Obvious....

[Sunking]

T12v 95ah battery and 2x100 watt panels are not enough to run a 13 watt draw and a 125 watt draw for a max of 3 hours a day and then 13 watts at an additional 11 hours a day. The guessing part is assuming the worst case scenario on the draw. That seems like a good amount of battery to me but I do plan on doubling that up. Any other help you can offer would be appreciated.

You have already stated what the problem is, you just do not know it. As soon as you said it died after just 2.5 days tells the tale.

(13x\w + 125w) x 3 h = 414 watt hours
+
13 watts x 11 hours = 143 watt hours
Total = 414 wh + 143 wh = 557 watt hours.

That requires a battery operating at 12 volts = 230 AH. You only have 95 AH.

As for panel wattage of 200 watts, very doubtful you can even generate 750 to 1000 wh per day, especially this time of year. You are using a PWM controller (huge mistake), which means you must generate at least 1100 watt hours per day and a minimum 5 Sun Hour day. Very few places on earth receive 5 Sun Hours in winter.. Many places do not even have 5 Sun Hours in summer. That means with 90% certainty you panel wattage is too low.

So back to your question: WRONG CONFIGURATION?

Is a big fat YES.

[LETitROLL]

This is a new battery. When I first hooked it up, it ran for 2 1/2 days and then died overnight. The water heater is thermostatically controlled and only draws as needed. My best guess is a maximum draw of 3 hours at 125 watts. That should be a total of roughly 50 amps a day with the 13 watt light on at 14 hours a day. Just to be clear, this gel battery is an AGM, not a sealed gel lead acid.

Make sure you are hooking up the battery first to the CC, then the panels last, most systems will not charge properly if you do not do it in that order, the CC needs to see the battery first to properly set the voltage, also are your panels hooked in series , or parallel ?

[Donniebosko]

Okay, thank you Sunking and everyone else. I am trying to sort this out. Sunking, you say I need more battery and more panel. That is way more than I want to spend on chickens. I did this as an alternative to running power to the coop. I'm into it for about 800 bucks now.... I can't justify much more than another battery. It's 200 more and I'm hoping that'll do it. If not, I'm cutting my losses there and running a hard line out there next spring. I disconnected the cables. Battery reads 12.96 volts. It is full. I reconnected the battery to the CC and then the panels to the CC. Voltage went up to 13.6. Now it is draining and was down to 12.88 inside of 5 minutes. I'll go out in an hour or so and see what's doing.