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  • need some battery advise

    Howdy... I have a 110v. 60w, 2 gal. heated bucket that I'd like to run off solar panel to keep poultry water from freezing this winter. I have a Harbor Freight 45 watt panel. The bucket's thermostatically controlled to come on at 40 deg or so. I'm in western Pennsylvania which is zone 5 on the solar insolation map, also zone 5b on a climatic zone map. I'm just guessing that given enough batteries this might be doable, though I have no idea what I need in terms of battery capacity. Any input appreciated!

    thanks.... Gary

  • #2
    Stop, do not buy anything because all your assumptions are DEAD WRONG.

    To start the box those Harbor Fright Panels came in is worth more and generates more power than the POS panels that come in them. Those panels are only worth $20.

    Second it takes a lot more power than you think, and will be very expensive. Far more expensive and less reliable than running commercial AC power to the chicken house. You have not even taken the first step yet to determine how many Watt Hours you need in a day or looked at your winter Sun Hours. Zone 5 don't mean chit. You live in PA with a Winter Insolation of pathetic 2 Sun Hours. That means you must use AGM batteries. That means for Every 1 Watt Hour consumed in a day requires 1 watt of panel, .06 amps of charge Controller, and 5 watt hours of battery.

    OK you still do not know what that means, maybe you will understand loosing your money. For each Watt Hour consumed will cost you roughly $2.50 to $3.00 per watt hour with 1/3 that cost in battery cost you must replace very few years. Stiil don't know what that means. Maybe this will help. You will need 500 to 2000 watt hours per day. At a modest 1 Kwh per day or 1000 watt hours peer cost will cost you $2500 to $3000, and battery replacement cost of $1000 every few years.

    Or spend a few hundred for a AC line and use al the power you want and need. You will be dead and buried before you spending $1000 heating up live stock water to th ePoweer company and never have any maintenance except changing out thermostats and burnt up heaters over the decades.
    MSEE, PE

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    • #3
      Thanks..... not the answer I was hoping for but likely the one I needed to hear! Going to start on that trench tomorrow.

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      • #4
        Electric resistance or really any kind of electric heat just isnt feasable if you can get grid to run it.
        NABCEP certified Technical Sales Professional

        [URL="http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showthread.php?5334-Solar-Off-Grid-Battery-Design"]http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showth...Battery-Design[/URL]

        [URL]http://www.calculator.net/voltage-drop-calculator.html[/URL] (Voltage drop Calculator among others)

        [URL="http://www.gaisma.com"]www.gaisma.com[/URL]

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        • #5
          Originally posted by blenderbender View Post
          Thanks..... not the answer I was hoping for but likely the one I needed to hear! Going to start on that trench tomorrow.
          When looking at the cost of running grid power, when you have such a small load by grid power standards, be sure to look at the alternative of putting a 12V landscape light transformer at the house end and running low voltage flexible wiring (rated for outdoor exposure like landscape cable) to the chicken shed. Then use a 12V water heating element. You could even run some 12VAC LED lights on the same wire.

          Your 60W bucket heater is probably too large to be powered that way (in addition to requiring 120V), but you should get a KillAWatt energy meter to see what it really averages out as it cycles on and off.
          It may be possible to do what you need with less power than was first calculated.
          Last edited by inetdog; 09-17-2015, 05:44 PM.
          SunnyBoy 3000 US, 18 BP Solar 175B panels.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by inetdog View Post
            When looking at the cost of running grid power, when you have such a small load by grid power standards, be sure to look at the alternative of putting a 12V landscape light transformer at the house end and running low voltage flexible wiring (rated for outdoor exposure like landscape cable) to the chicken shed. Then use a 12V water heating element. You could even run some 12VAC LED lights on the same wire.

            Your 60W bucket heater is probably too large to be powered that way (in addition to requiring 120V), but you should get a KillAWatt energy meter to see what it really averages out as it cycles on and off.
            It may be possible to do what you need with less power than was first calculated.
            The issue in this case is it would take at least one entire winter to monitor how much the heater uses.
            Chicken houses are not heated or there would be no need. Also with constantly varying ambient temps one day could use very little and the next be on all day and night
            A bit difficult to design for without long term data without either building too big or too small. Either case is a financial loser.
            NABCEP certified Technical Sales Professional

            [URL="http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showthread.php?5334-Solar-Off-Grid-Battery-Design"]http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showth...Battery-Design[/URL]

            [URL]http://www.calculator.net/voltage-drop-calculator.html[/URL] (Voltage drop Calculator among others)

            [URL="http://www.gaisma.com"]www.gaisma.com[/URL]

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Naptown View Post
              The issue in this case is it would take at least one entire winter to monitor how much the heater uses.
              True, but you could at least put the bucket in a freezer for a few hours to get a very rough baseline.
              Hopefully the bucket has insulation, otherwise it is really wasting power.
              SunnyBoy 3000 US, 18 BP Solar 175B panels.

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              • #8
                But the freezer is a constant temp and well below what would be experienced in the hen house regularly
                NABCEP certified Technical Sales Professional

                [URL="http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showthread.php?5334-Solar-Off-Grid-Battery-Design"]http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showth...Battery-Design[/URL]

                [URL]http://www.calculator.net/voltage-drop-calculator.html[/URL] (Voltage drop Calculator among others)

                [URL="http://www.gaisma.com"]www.gaisma.com[/URL]

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Naptown View Post
                  But the freezer is a constant temp and well below what would be experienced in the hen house regularly
                  But it would provide a potentially useful upper limit on power consumption.
                  SunnyBoy 3000 US, 18 BP Solar 175B panels.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by inetdog View Post
                    It may be possible to do what you need with less power than was first calculated.
                    60 watt load for how long tells the story. Lets say it needs to operate 12 hours per day or the night hours in which temps are cold enough to freeze. Say 50% Duty cycle. is 360 watt hours. I say that is a fair realistic number to use for argument. To do that in Winter where he lives would require 270 watts, 25 amp MPPT Controller, and a 12 volt 150 AH AGM battery. Now go shopping and total it up.

                    The only person who needs to know is the OP, and he decides if it is affordable.
                    MSEE, PE

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