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Choosing between a 4 to 4.5 kW inverter system. SMA vs. Solaredge vs Sparq

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  • Choosing between a 4 to 4.5 kW inverter system. SMA vs. Solaredge vs Sparq

    I'm looking at getting a fairly straight forward 4 kW solar array on my roof. SW facing. Some minor tree shading issues in the morning. After 10:30 am it's all sun.

    I'm currently waiting for some quotes to come in. But I'm having trouble deciding on an inverter system.

    I've been thinking of going Solar Edge. I like the idea of the per panel monitoring, the central garage inverter, and the DC safety aspect. But I have to see some cost estimates compared to a traditional inverter.

    Speaking of Enphase, I'm going to stay away. It's a roof mounted system, it'll be one big square, and with 16 panels needing 16 micro inverters, just seems like a hassle. I like the micro inverter concept, but too many parts.

    However, there's a new micro inverter company that just came to market. They're called Sparq. They have a 1000W micro that feeds four panels. I am attracted to their system in concept. It appears to be a fairly simple install. Preliminary pricing seems competitive. I like that you just hook four up, run AC to your breaker, install the monitoring gateway and that's it. Also, with only four micros, less to go wrong. But they're a new company with a new product and with anything new, you're taking a risk.

    So that's what I'm looking at. I'll have to see some full quotes. I'm thinking that if a traditional SMA inverter is way cheaper than the Solaredge, I may go with that. If the Solaredge and SMA come up similar, I would probably lean to Solaredge. If I was to go micro, I'd probably try the Sparq and want to see some pricing with that.

    Anyway, That's what I'm looking at. I hope to get my first set of quotes next week.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Admiral Ackbar View Post
    I'm looking at getting a fairly straight forward 4 kW solar array on my roof. SW facing. Some minor tree shading issues in the morning. After 10:30 am it's all sun. I'm currently waiting for some quotes to come in. But I'm having trouble deciding on an inverter system.I've been thinking of going Solar Edge. I like the idea of the per panel monitoring, the central garage inverter, and the DC safety aspect. But I have to see some cost estimates compared to a traditional inverter.Speaking of Enphase, I'm going to stay away. It's a roof mounted system, it'll be one big square, and with 16 panels needing 16 micro inverters, just seems like a hassle. I like the micro inverter concept, but too many parts.However, there's a new micro inverter company that just came to market. They're called Sparq. They have a 1000W micro that feeds four panels. I am attracted to their system in concept. It appears to be a fairly simple install. Preliminary pricing seems competitive. I like that you just hook four up, run AC to your breaker, install the monitoring gateway and that's it. Also, with only four micros, less to go wrong. But they're a new company with a new product and with anything new, you're taking a risk.So that's what I'm looking at. I'll have to see some full quotes. I'm thinking that if a traditional SMA inverter is way cheaper than the Solaredge, I may go with that. If the Solaredge and SMA come up similar, I would probably lean to Solaredge. If I was to go micro, I'd probably try the Sparq and want to see some pricing with that.Anyway, That's what I'm looking at. I hope to get my first set of quotes next week.
    Interesting 4:1 micro inverter.......the other side of this is that if one micro goes down you lose 25% of your capacity vs. traditional micro inverter goes down and you lose 6.25% in the system you describe.I have Enphase 215's and I really like the individual panel/microinverter monitoring. If the installer is serious about Enphase just get them to throw in a couple of extras and you're set if you lose one......they are pretty cheap ad having a spare makes sense........my .02

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    • #3
      Looks like you're in AZ. Are you worried about the heat with your micros?

      I see your point about failure but my thinking was kinda opposite. You're right that if one fails I lose 1 panel. But with 16 Enphase I think I have a greater chance for 1 to go. If I only have 4 Sparq, and assuming the reliability is similar, I have less parts to go bad. But if one does, I lose a quarter.

      To give example, I have an engineer co-worker who built a ground mount solar farm in his large backyard. He installed 90 Enphase micros. He thinks they're great. He's lost 3 in five years. Assuming that a piece of electronics has a roughly 3-5% failure rate in the first five years and he's right on target. He says it takes him 10 minutes to switch out the defective unit and swap in the new one. But it's a ground mount. Even with his own personal experience, he said he probably wouldn't put an Enphase on a roof, because it's harder to access if a micro goes bad.

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      • #4
        SolarEdge will probably be a little bit more than SMA, but not a lot. The optimizers are only about $60 a piece, and the inverters themselves tend to be a hair cheaper than standard inverters.

        I saw the Sparq inverters recently as well. I'm interested in what they cost thought. They're quite large and heavy, probably similar to 4 micro inverters I suppose though. I believe they give you individual panel monitoring as well, but I didn't look into it.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Admiral Ackbar View Post
          Looks like you're in AZ. Are you worried about the heat with your micros?I see your point about failure but my thinking was kinda opposite. You're right that if one fails I lose 1 panel. But with 16 Enphase I think I have a greater chance for 1 to go. If I only have 4 Sparq, and assuming the reliability is similar, I have less parts to go bad. But if one does, I lose a quarter.To give example, I have an engineer co-worker who built a ground mount solar farm in his large backyard. He installed 90 Enphase micros. He thinks they're great. He's lost 3 in five years. Assuming that a piece of electronics has a roughly 3-5% failure rate in the first five years and he's right on target. He says it takes him 10 minutes to switch out the defective unit and swap in the new one. But it's a ground mount. Even with his own personal experience, he said he probably wouldn't put an Enphase on a roof, because it's harder to access if a micro goes bad.
          Great question....I actually come from the electronics manufacturing business so I have a bit of background in these things and it is VERY hot here in AZ where we are FOR SURE. We consider 103 a cool day here in the summer so the concerns are valid. My experience is that most solid state electronics have a much higher infant mortality than later in the life cycle, even in the brutal infrastructure Marketplace (read cell phone provider equipment installed in remote locations).

          In my solar installation the access to the inverters is not too bad with only 4 hex nuts to loosen with the electric impact driver and you have access......I actually had an inverter that wasn't up to speed after the first couple of months and I was all set to change it out until I found a poor connection during install when diagnosing the failure and in 15 minutes I had it fixed. I actually think that I had a much easier time troubleshooting specifically because I had a clear picture of which panel was not producing to spec, and was able to go directly to he culprit and quickly was able to asses the issue......changing the micro inverter had it actually failed would have taken a similar amount of time....5 minutes more maybe.

          We are in a remote location and do have 2 extra inverters for future requirements (provided by supplier as part of package)....will this be enough??...maybe but at least I am very happy to have this level of self-diagnosis and serviceability. Personally I don't have a big preference but I will say that the Micro inverter install was really very straightforward and I believe the servicibility will be very easy going forward.....good luck

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          • #6
            Originally posted by emartin00 View Post
            SolarEdge will probably be a little bit more than SMA, but not a lot. The optimizers are only about $60 a piece, and the inverters themselves tend to be a hair cheaper than standard inverters.

            I saw the Sparq inverters recently as well. I'm interested in what they cost thought. They're quite large and heavy, probably similar to 4 micro inverters I suppose though. I believe they give you individual panel monitoring as well, but I didn't look into it.
            Approximately $500 a piece with the 25 year warranty. Plus throw in another $500 for the 4 trunk lines and control box. Approximately. I have to see some actual contractor quotes though to see what they would charge me. They're only working through contractors because they want to make sure the work is done right. No DIY.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Admiral Ackbar View Post
              Approximately $500 a piece with the 25 year warranty. Plus throw in another $500 for the 4 trunk lines and control box. Approximately. I have to see some actual contractor quotes though to see what they would charge me. They're only working through contractors because they want to make sure the work is done right. No DIY.
              If you have doubts about the 4th generation Enphase product, why do you want to try the 1st generation Sparq with virtually no installation base. The reason they only want to work with particular installers is to have a controlled product release and monitor them closely to iron out any problems/design flaws, so they don't have to do mass RMAs. Your money, your choice but beware.
              16xLG300N1C+SE6000[url]http://tiny.cc/ojmxyx[/url]

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              • #8
                Originally posted by thejq View Post
                If you have doubts about the 4th generation Enphase product, why do you want to try the 1st generation Sparq with virtually no installation base. The reason they only want to work with particular installers is to have a controlled product release and monitor them closely to iron out any problems/design flaws, so they don't have to do mass RMAs. Your money, your choice but beware.
                This^^^^^

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                • #9
                  Yeah, that's kinda my thinking on why I wouldn't go sparq. There's just no history, even thought the system looks interesting.

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                  • #10
                    Maybe I'm over thinking this. I've read a bunch of horror stories about the Enphase units. But supposedly there are a ton of m250's out there. The solar edge also would have a bunch of dc optimizers on the roof too. So it could be the best or both of both worlds. If the optimizer start going, then i gotta replace those and the central inverter.

                    I understand that this is new tech, but I guess it's been around for three or four years now. Is there a general sense that, "This stuff works. It's been pretty reliable so far, we just don't know how it'll look in ten years."

                    That's a different approach then saying, "Hey, it's reliable in theory, but we don't really know enough to say anything at all." And I think that's where I get hung up on. Also, being an engineer I tend to overthink things. So maybe I'm just overthinking.

                    In general though, I'm 70% leaning towards a solaredge unit. Any specific comments on their system?

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                    • #11
                      My last thoughts on this....the Enphase is probably the most tried and true units out there with the largest installed base.....mine do fine in 115 degree heat and make consistently solid power.......that being said I wish you luck with whichever direction you go.Paul

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by paul65k View Post
                        My last thoughts on this....the Enphase is probably the most tried and true units out there with the largest installed base.....mine do fine in 115 degree heat and make consistently solid power.......that being said I wish you luck with whichever direction you go.Paul
                        True, but if you want to see the dominant leader in decline, look at ENPH stock, then also look at SEDG which has declined, but still has a significantly higher relative price to sales. Either is too much of a gamble for my liking. I looked up Sparq, they are still private equity. I like their concept and will look forward to seeing how they will fit in. I wonder how much of a liability ENPH is showing on their balance sheet for future failures, and also SEDG for that matter.

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