Bulk pricing for solar installations?

[sensij]

Scientific American had a write up today describing a deal in which one national solar company is offering "bulk rate" installations to the employees of companies who subscribe. If you work for one of the companies involved, you'll probably be getting some press about it internally. What caught my attention is that "through the end of the year, the program is open to all U.S. and Canadian homeowners, regardless of employer affiliation".

This company is one who is building their business model as an online broker, connecting customers to installers. In one of their press releases they described their goal to become "the kayak.com of solar." I think that is a stretch, there is plenty of competition with a similar business model, and I have no idea what their vetting process is on the installers with whom they might connect a customer. I also have no idea whether working with them is good or bad. There is a lot I do not like about what is advertised on the webpages. Having said that, if they are really offering installs at $2.80 - $3.20 / watt as the article indicated, and if you are actively shopping right now, it might be worth getting a proposal and doing some due diligence.

[Sunnyvalejohn]

It will be interesting to see if their prices are really lower than other quotes from the area. Sounds good on paper.

[sensij]

Well, I've decided to be a guinea pig for this one. I gave them a call, and they were pretty upfront apologetic about the misinformation ("bugs") on the webpage, and did not try to make any BS sales pitches once I explained where I am at in the shopping process. They said that for a system of my size, and as a result of the discount program I mentioned, they could offer $3.30 / W with 12 year, 2.99% financing. Not quite what was published, but it is a small system (3 kW max), so I'm not too surprised. That pricing is still better than what I've seen anywhere else. Their TOS also indicate that the system size will be limited to 100% of the previous year consumption, although I don't know what kind of PV generation model they are using. Sounds good so far.

Unfortunately, their process requires an agreement to their TOS at this point, which basically means I need to fill out the loan application (and I assume take a credit check hit). They will not commit to a particular system size or equipment selection until after their design team reviews my file.

I'm willing to let this play out, and will update the thread as it develops.

[russ]

Well, I've decided to be a guinea pig for this one.

Good information for everyone - thanks!

[silversaver]

Well, I've decided to be a guinea pig for this one. I gave them a call, and they were pretty upfront apologetic about the misinformation ("bugs") on the webpage, and did not try to make any BS sales pitches once I explained where I am at in the shopping process. They said that for a system of my size, and as a result of the discount program I mentioned, they could offer $3.30 / W with 12 year, 2.99% financing. Not quite what was published, but it is a small system (3 kW max), so I'm not too surprised. That pricing is still better than what I've seen anywhere else. Their TOS also indicate that the system size will be limited to 100% of the previous year consumption, although I don't know what kind of PV generation model they are using. Sounds good so far.

Unfortunately, their process requires an agreement to their TOS at this point, which basically means I need to fill out the loan application (and I assume take a credit check hit). They will not commit to a particular system size or equipment selection until after their design team reviews my file.

I'm willing to let this play out, and will update the thread as it develops.

Sound like good info, but really?


Hope it is not like " absolutely $0 down and you start to save money every month......blah blah" You need a completely picture, not only what you like to see. I call that an ads.... so what's the bank fee for 2.99%? I'm sure you don't know, because there is no 2.99% financing anywhere without a bank fee. Fill out a credit application without knowing any detail? haha good luck. I just laught about it because I have so many friends telling me about getting solar is free everywhere.

[sensij]

Sound like good info, but really?


Hope it is not like " absolutely $0 down and you start to save money every month......blah blah" You need a completely picture, not only what you like to see. I call that an ads.... so what's the bank fee for 2.99%? I'm sure you don't know, because there is no 2.99% financing anywhere without a bank fee. Fill out a credit application without knowing any detail? haha good luck. I just laught about it because I have so many friends telling me about getting solar is free everywhere.

Nobody is saying I'm going to start to save every month, that what I mean when I wrote that they did not attempt the BS I had expected. A system this size will take several years to get into the black, even with the federal tax rebate. Yes there is sure to be a fee, but maybe it was rolled into the price they offered, maybe not. The details of their offer are what I hope to find out, and share. FWIW, I already have a 1.89% financed offer locked in from a different installer for around $3.85 / W, and they had rolled the bank fee of around $1000 into the system price. There isn't much risk for me to pursue this one in parallel, at least while I'm still in the cooling off period on the other contract.

[Bikerscum]

FWIW, I already have a 1.89% financed offer locked in from a different installer for around $3.85 / W, and they had rolled the bank fee of around $1000 into the system price. There isn't much risk for me to pursue this one in parallel, at least while I'm still in the cooling off period on the other contract.

In CA isn't your "cooling off period" 3 days?

[sensij]

In CA isn't your "cooling off period" 3 days?

Yes, that is the state mandated minimum. This particular contract allowed 10.

[motodave]

Having said that, if they are really offering installs at $2.80 - $3.20 / watt as the article indicated, and if you are actively shopping right now, it might be worth getting a proposal and doing some due diligence.

This one mentions you need to put in a promo code "solarmojo" to get the discount: http://cleantechnica.com/2014/10/23/...y-price-break/

[sensij]

Update... financing was approved, including enough over the cost of the PV system to also cover the roofing work that will need to be done. They will attempt to connect with me an installer who is qualified to do both. System design should be done in the next day or two.

Thanks for the tip on the discount code... if the pricing still doesn't look right after applying it, calling and mentioning the promotion should get it done.

[J.P.M.]

Update... financing was approved, including enough over the cost of the PV system to also cover the roofing work that will need to be done. They will attempt to connect with me an installer who is qualified to do both. System design should be done in the next day or two.

Thanks for the tip on the discount code... if the pricing still doesn't look right after applying it, calling and mentioning the promotion should get it done.

Not preaching, but as usual, Caveat Emptor. Terrible to pay too much - worse to pay too little. I'd be concerned about sloppy seconds on panels/inverters or mongrels for both and little choice in the matter of vendor selection.

I'll be interested to see if this is a decent deal or if Cleantechnica turns out to be a shill for a referral fee.

Good luck - honest.

J.P.M.

[sensij]

Not preaching, but as usual, Caveat Emptor. Terrible to pay too much - worse to pay too little. I'd be concerned about sloppy seconds on panels/inverters or mongrels for both and little choice in the matter of vendor selection.

I'll be interested to see if this is a decent deal or if Cleantechnica turns out to be a shill for a referral fee.

Good luck - honest.

J.P.M.

Legitimate concerns, which is why I'm documenting my experience. Given the companies involved in the partnership (per the original article linked, 3M Co., Cisco Systems Inc., Kimberly-Clark Corp. and the National Geographic Society), there is reason to believe that the offer is legitimate, and the equipment isn't rejects being sold out of someone's garage. I hadn't pinned Scientific American as a shill either, but you never really know. In any case, giving up some degree of control over the actual installer used is required, which may be a deal-breaker for some. On the other hand, the selected installer may be more motivated to perform well if future business from a potentially high volume broker is at risk.

[ButchDeal]

Legitimate concerns, which is why I'm documenting my experience. Given the companies involved in the partnership (per the original article linked, 3M Co., Cisco Systems Inc., Kimberly-Clark Corp. and the National Geographic Society), there is reason to believe that the offer is legitimate, and the equipment isn't rejects being sold out of someone's garage. I hadn't pinned Scientific American as a shill either, but you never really know. In any case, giving up some degree of control over the actual installer used is required, which may be a deal-breaker for some. On the other hand, the selected installer may be more motivated to perform well if future business from a potentially high volume broker is at risk.

I believe this is on the same deal: http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showth...-47-watt/page5

[wwu123]

I'm all for group buys and bulk negotiation, and I've seen it done for anything from ski trips to luxury bags, and I believe a few years ago a bunch of homeowners nearby did do a bulk negotiation on PV solar. That all said, when it's not really a group purchase but more of a referral network or broker model, there's an intermediary that needs to get paid, and there's less economy of scale from the sales/marketing to vendor being able to negotiate in bulk up their supply chain, versus a true bulk purchase. Maybe if there's a venture-backed vendor in the mix, someone may pump marketing budget in the form of promotional discounts, and that can provide some short-term, nonsustainable incentives to get publicity and marketing awareness.

But in general, most of the "employee discount/perks" programs I've seen like this give a modest discount and benefit for those who just don't bother to negotiate at all, but never as good as you'll get by shopping around or negotiating yourself after doing your homework.

But certainly would be great if this does get better prices for a lot of people though, and if it convincnes a lot more people to sign up for solar.

[sensij]

I'm all for group buys and bulk negotiation, and I've seen it done for anything from ski trips to luxury bags, and I believe a few years ago a bunch of homeowners nearby did do a bulk negotiation on PV solar. That all said, when it's not really a group purchase but more of a referral network or broker model, there's an intermediary that needs to get paid, and there's less economy of scale from the sales/marketing to vendor being able to negotiate in bulk up their supply chain, versus a true bulk purchase. Maybe if there's a venture-backed vendor in the mix, someone may pump marketing budget in the form of promotional discounts, and that can provide some short-term, nonsustainable incentives to get publicity and marketing awareness.

But in general, most of the "employee discount/perks" programs I've seen like this give a modest discount and benefit for those who just don't bother to negotiate at all, but never as good as you'll get by shopping around or negotiating yourself after doing your homework.

But certainly would be great if this does get better prices for a lot of people though, and if it convincnes a lot more people to sign up for solar.

I agree that the pricing as stated doesn't look sustainable, and is probably being subsidized by a marketing budget in the short run, and by expenses borne by the employers who partner up in the long run. I've been trying for a couple months to negotiate prices down to this level though, so I'm not so sure that someone who is shopping around would be able to match this. For a 3 kW system, which is sure to be more expensive per watt than the larger systems you've seen posted in this forum, I had several installers decline to quote when I requested < $4.00 / W, and only one even considered < $3.50 / W before declining. $3.30 / W with good financing is a steal, the question is whether or not the customer will pay for it in other ways, as previous posters have suggested.